Just wondering if one of you might be able to point me to a reference explaining how "Keoland" got its name (I've searched the forums, skimmed through many of Samwise's excellent articles, and read through LGJ#1, without finding a definite answer). I understand that the Keogh tribe of Oeridians constitutes a substantial proportion of the kingdom's population and that the Oeridians effectively are "kingmakers" because they dominate the membership of the Court of the Land (LGJ#1), but given that the Suel were there first, that the kingdom's first ruler was Suloise, and that most of the kingdom's rulers have come from one of the Suloise houses... it seems odd that the kingdom should be named after the Keogh.
If no explanation exists, whether in canon or fan-created articles... what do you think would be a logical explanation for the name? Simple appeasement of the Keogh population/nobles seems a bit weak...
I think there might have been some discussions about this in the forums, so you might have luck searching them. It is my understanding that Gygax named the kingdom after his friend Tom Keogh also of the famous Keoghtom. I think the Suel history of domination came later. I guess the way to go about it to say that Keoland is largely an Oeridian Kingdom, named after an Oeridian tribe, speaking an Oeridian-Suel hybrid language out of which the name arose. That the leaders have been Suel is secondary to the issue of naming. IMO it is easier to follow than the naming of America.
The way I worked it out, it became the Kingdom of Keoland because the Oerid were the first people to call it a Kingdom and its Ruler a King.
For the Suel that founded the country, it was a Regency and the ruler was Regent (and it WAS NOT called Keoland)
The first Oerid Regent was styled "King" by his own folk. This happened about the time Keoish as a language was developing. In Oerid, "Keo" simply means people, so the Oerid title King of Keoland meant simply King of the People's Land (or, "Our Land"). Originally this title was only used by the Oerid, the the Suel insisted on calling it a Regency. Over the generations the title of King of Keoland spread with the Keoish language. _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
If no explanation exists, whether in canon or fan-created articles... what do you think would be a logical explanation for the name? Simple appeasement of the Keogh population/nobles seems a bit weak...
I'm surprised you didn't find it wandering around some of the other stuff I wrote about Keoland.
The "Keogh" for the Oeridian tribe isn't a personal name, but rather translates along the line of "Allies." The tribes weren't related by blood, but were a political alliance, like the Iroquois.
The nation was originally named bilingually. By quirk, it is the Oeridian version that evolved to the current name, from Keogh Rond to Keoland, and means simple "Land of the Allies."
If no explanation exists, whether in canon or fan-created articles... what do you think would be a logical explanation for the name? Simple appeasement of the Keogh population/nobles seems a bit weak...
I'm surprised you didn't find it wandering around some of the other stuff I wrote about Keoland.
The "Keogh" for the Oeridian tribe isn't a personal name, but rather translates along the line of "Allies." The tribes weren't related by blood, but were a political alliance, like the Iroquois.
The nation was originally named bilingually. By quirk, it is the Oeridian version that evolved to the current name, from Keogh Rond to Keoland, and means simple "Land of the Allies."
Well Sam, you've written so much that I haven't had a chance to read everything as thoroughly as I would have liked! I quite like your explanation though, and that suggested by Kirt as well.
My thanks to both of you (and Wolfsire) for taking the time to share your thoughts!
Here's an excerpt of the relevant part from my Keoland writings. This will eventually make its way into the OJ.
c. S.D. 5266 to 5360 (CY –250 to CY –157)
Keoish language and culture develop. Expansion in west and north; Javan River Valley assumed, Sterich incorporated, Gran March pacified.
The birth of Keoland
By midway through the 53rd Century of the Suel Dominion, the majority of Regency citizens were engaged in farming. Some herdsmen persisted in the eastern hills and northern plains, but Regency culture had undeniably become a peasant, farming culture. The lives of the common folk of the Regency became increasingly similar regardless of their race. United by their common agrarian lifestyle and common technology, it was becoming difficult to separate Suel from Oerid from Flan. Though the older villages remained insular holds of a single racial strain, the lords of the land were causing new villages to be founded all the time. The work crews that built roads or turned forests into farms were levied from throughout a lord’s domain, and often were of varied racial composition. Many of these workers developed friendships and romances in the new villages to which they were sent to labor, and stayed on or returned after their service was ended. Inter-racial marriage among the rural peasantry was becoming widespread; in the trading towns it had been common for a century. Suel, Oerid, and Flan shared their languages (65), bloodlines (66), and culture, creating a composite national identity.
The nobility were rather more careful to preserve their Suloise or Oeridian heritage, but they too had the blood of many races in their veins, including that of elves (64, 66). Although it is still possible to speak of the oldest parts of Keoland as being “Suel”or “Oeridian” (67), this distinction applies only to the nobles and the general cultural overtones. The people themselves are a thorough mixture (64, 65). In the 53rd century SD, a general sentiment of unified nationhood, not separate racial identity, was developing. This feeling was born in Jurnre (31), but spread outward throughout the Regency.
It was in Jurnre and the County of Ulek that the language of the Oeridian petty lords became infused with the speech of the Suel, the Flan, and with numerous demi-human tongues as well, eventually becoming what is now known as Keolandish (65). From there this speech spread throughout the country, a language that united the many peoples of the Regency before Common existed (65). At first a trade language, Keolandish was quickly adopted anywhere the different races needed to understand one another. It soon became the standard language of work crews and military units. The general populace took to it slowly, but naturally. The Oeridian noble crowned as Regent Mandros I in SD 5244 (68) had a rather limited command of the Suel tongue. Fortunately for him, heralds who turned phrases more eloquently then their liege performed most of the public speaking for the nobility. Early in his reign, Mandros was content to let his heralds speak in Suel, the language of court. Later on, a more mature and confident Mandros required his heralds to speak in the new Keolandish. Having one’s herald speak the new language immediately became fashionable with any noble who sought the favor of the Regent, even those pure Suel nobles who would never stoop to speak the language themselves.
In the new tongue, the nation itself was called Keoland, meaning “our land”, from the same Oeridian root that allowed the Keogh to call themselves “we kinsmen”. The Regent was known as the King of Keoland in the new tongue, and Mandros eventually used this title in preference to that of “Regent” in the Suel language. Though it would be centuries before any Suel Regent would allow himself be addressed as the “King of Keoland”, the common folk rapidly picked up the new title.
64) “The Neheli have largely eschewed the racial mixing common to almost everyone else in Keoland since Keoland’s founding. The only exceptions seem to be the olvenkind, to whom the Neheli have always shown a liking.” LGJ1, p.15
66) “The county was awarded to a clan of primarily Oeridian descent, which promptly took a seat on the Court of the Land.” LGJ1, p.13. That the clan is only of primarily Oeridian descent implies that other bloodlines are present as well.
“The Margrave of Middlemead, Lord Kharn…is like most noblemen of the midlands primarily of Oeridian descent. However, the population of the province is relatively well-mixed, including some Suel and Flan enclaves.” LGJ1, p.14
“This cooperation has continued ever since and the barony is now held by a minor noble house, known as the Lizhal, who migrated along with the Rhola and Neheli following the Twin Catclysms. Unlike the majority of those two houses, the Lizhal are heavily intermarried with both Oeridian and elven bloodlines.” LGJ1, p.15
67) “In Oeridian areas of the Kingdom, both nobles and commoners remain reserved in their acceptance of the general use of magic. Hence, in those areas, chapters of the Academy usually keep a lower profile than in the more tolerant Suel regions.” NAW.pdf, p.1
68) The fifth Regent, Mandros I of Sedenna, “The Oeridian”, ruled CY –272 to –236. LGJ1, p.9 _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
Bu they are not terribly similar. I have the NAW.pdf saved as an electronic copy. Unfortunately, no author is given. If you can find out from Sam or the current triad who the author WAS, I will ask their permission to share it with interested parties. _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
The article looks kewl! Will it finally identify all the remaining Keoish rulers, such as the Baron of Estgant?
As kewl as the Kewl River, my friend. No, it does not go up to present day. It is mostly historical, and ends at the close of the Hateful Wars.
Names and personalities are really not my bag. I leave that to Sam and Gary. I am more of a historical-economic-cultural trends and geopolitics guy. My intention in writing it was to make a synthesis of all available info and fill in the important holes. _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
Wow Kirt, thanks for sharing! I'm impressed, and looking forward to seeing the full publication in the OJ!
You're welcome, and hope it helped. You can look at the first installment about two OJ's ago, but don't hold your breath for this next one. RL stuff has my Greyhawk output very limited these days, and the Keoland OJ stuff requires an investment of several weeks for an installment. It WILL happen, but not any time soon!
If you would like to help the process, and have a copy of the LGG, you can track down that page number I need in citation 65!
OTOH, I would be happy to send or post excerpts on any topic of your interest. _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
Last edited by Kirt on Thu Sep 21, 2006 8:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
Bu they are not terribly similar. I have the NAW.pdf saved as an electronic copy. Unfortunately, no author is given. If you can find out from Sam or the current triad who the author WAS, I will ask their permission to share it with interested parties.
Err . . .
I don't recall. I'd have to see the specific document to make a guess. I'm pretty sure the first iteration or two were by P-A Sicart if you can track him down. Otherwise I'd hazard a guess that Christian Alipounarian contributed to the next revision, or would have the best idea who did.
And in general, I'd go with the earliest version of anything from the LG sites. The history has gotten its own revisions over time.
Wow Kirt, thanks for sharing! I'm impressed, and looking forward to seeing the full publication in the OJ!
You're welcome, and hope it helped. You can look at the first installment about two OJ's ago, but don't hold your breath for this next one. RL stuff has my Greyhawk output very limited these days, and the Keoland OJ stuff requires an investment of several weeks for an installment. It WILL happen, but not any time soon!
If you would like to help the process, and have a copy of the LGG, you can track down that page number I need in citation 65!
OTOH, I would be happy to send or post excerpts on any topic of your interest.
The LGG page number for citation 65 is 12.
I symptathize with your RL stuff, it's prevented me from DMing/playing for a veeeeeery long time, and from contributing to Canonfire. I have tons of ideas, but...
Thanks for offering to post/send excerpts... I'll let you know if something specific comes to mind!
Thanks!! _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
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I quite like your explanation though, and that suggested by Kirt as well.
