STAR TREK MOVIE SPOILERS. STAR TEK MOVIE SPOILERS. STAR TREK MOVIE SPOILERS.
I saw the new Star Trek movie this weekend by JJ Abrams. The furor among “Trekkers” has been that it violates Star Trek canon. Abrams isn’t bashful in saying that this Star Trek “reimagines” and attempts to “restart” the franchise, canon to either side.
In fact, the movies does just this – reconfigures canon to create something unbeholden to accumulated canon. However, it should be noted that thanks to a plot element there is a STRONG tie to prior canon, even as an entirely new canon emerges.
Essentially, Abrams creates an alternate universe Star Trek with a link to the prior canon Star Trek Universe. And he does so brilliantly! While I’m sorry to see the prior canon universe go, I very much like the new version depicted in the film. Star Trek as a movie franchise, and likely a TV franchise, has new life thanks to this “restart/reimagining.” Opening weekend US box office was estimated at $75 million.
Could the same technique be used for Greyhawk?
Due to a time wrap, the prehistory of the Star Trek universe is altered; it will unfold in a different way from the point of change – essentially Kirk’s birthdate. Spock, called Spock Prime, is cast from the future universe (very cleverly) into the now altered past. How altered? For example, Vulcan is destroyed. Gone. It won’t be there when Captain Picard shows up – if there ever is a Captain Picard in the changed timeline. The movie then focuses on the young Kirk, young Spock et. al.
Tovag Baragu on Oerth could enable a similar temporal mishap (Guardians of Infinity or no Guardians of Infinity).
The focus of the “restarted/reimagined” Flanaess could be set in the time of a young Mordenkainen, Tenser etc., pre-Circle of Eight, pre-Citadel of Eight, pre-Obsidian Citadel etc. Essentially, the Flanaess pre-Mordenkainen the neutral “balancer”/power broker. The iconic NPCs would all be present but as younger, less experienced, even untried versions of their later selves.
Then change some event so that Greyhawk history will not unfold as per established canon, but will still be recognizable for all that. By way of example, even in the new Star Trek, the Klingons and Romulans remain the Federation’s adversaries as of Kirk’s becoming captain of the Enterprise.
What event? On a par with Vulcan being destroyed.
Maybe the Rain of Colorless Fire/Invoked Devastation never took place. The Suel and Baklunish Empires still exist and they colonized the Flanaess in place of the Great Migrations. The colonial yoke was thrown off when the Flan wizard/warlord Vecna united oppressed colonists and native Flan in a war of liberation, quickly followed by Vecna’s home grown tyranny. Vecna then achieved lichdom and ruled his dark empire until he was betrayed by his lieutenant, the cambion Iuz. Iuz, however, could not hold the empire together and wound up imprisoned. Maybe the campaign starts as this Iuz is freed by ???
Or some otherwise.
Prior to see the new Star Trek movie, I would not have believed a “restart/reimagining” could work. Now, I believe it could be done and done well. _________________ GVD
Vulcan is destroyed 25 years after the reboot begins. That means all the history up to that point, save for those events changed by the destruction of the starship Kirk's father was on (for example, the childhood of James T. Kirk himself) remains the same.
As such, rebooting things like the Rain of Colorless Fire or the reign of Vecna would create a vastly greater difference than what we saw in the new Star Trek movie. 1000 years of altered history offers much greater opportunities for change (for good or ill) than something that only just happened.
Vulcan is an important planet in the Star Wars franchise. Destroying it signaled that no holds were barred, and anything could happen despite what we remembered from the other movies and TV shows - Kirk and Spock could die, Earth itself could be destroyed - and thus a certain dramatic tension was maintained. We were freed from letting our knowledge of future events diminish the present suspense. Even so, Vulcan isn't the most important planet in the franchise by a long shot. Destroying Bajor, where the DS9 series took place, would have had far greater consequences (no DS9 series, for example). While the repercussions of the new Star Wars movie mean that the future is now unwritten and anything can happen, at the same time they don't actually preclude anything from happening other than some relatively small things (Spock doesn't have to deal with his mother dying later on because she's already dead; he has to go to a Vulcan colony world rather than his homeworld to get his soul transferred from McCoy's body to his own, etc.).
So any comparison with possible events on Oerth should keep this sort of scale in mind. It has to be something recent, not something that happened a thousand years ago, and it can't foreclose any possibility of a major future event occurring in some similar way. So the Suel Imperium is still turned to ash, Iuz or Vecna can't be killed off, and so on. An equivalent event would be definitively changing one of the events of the Greyhawk Wars, or leading up to the Greyhawk Wars - perhaps Vatun returns for real before Iuz can scatter the Swords of Corusk, for example. Maybe Robilar dies before he can free Iuz (thereby not ruling out the cambion being freed later on by the PCs, but definitely changing history - someone else might take Sir Robilar's place in Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk). Maybe Prince Thrommel is rescued from beneath the Temple of Elemental Evil and successfully unites Veluna and Furyondy. Maybe Lolth's invasion of Sterich isn't thwarted, and she rules it still. Maybe the elven invasion of the Lendore Isles is thwarted when the elven fleet is sunk by aboleths (but there are still fanatic elves in the Flanaess who may reattempt an invasion at a later date, once those pesky aboleths are dealt with). I wouldn't go with destroying a nation unless it can be replaced with something just as interesting - versions of Tenh that have been reduced to wastelands don't strike me as very useful.
Anything on that scale would be similar to what was done in the new Star Trek.
I would agree with Rip that a "reboot" in the style of the new Star Trek movie would have to alter something in the relatively near past: the adventurers in "Vecna Lives!" fail to stop Vecna at Tovag Baragu or the adventurers fail to stop Iggwilv and Tuerny on Luna in "Return of the Eight"...These alternative endings would lead to a different Greyhawk from what we know today while still keeping the essential flavor of the campaign world...Anything too far back into the past would cause too many series of changes to keep a recognizable Greyhawk...
As a side note, I take it, Rip, that when you write Star Wars, you mean Star Trek...Mixing the two might be interesting, but the time frames are too far apart to know what a combination of the two would look like ...You know, "Along time ago in a galaxy far, far away"...
I think something early on or more recently could work - the inevitable catch being how it is done.
More recently, I think pre-Citadel of Eight with younger Mordy etc. running around holds lots of potential. PCs could interact with these NPCs as equals and play a very personal role in how they develop and and thus how the Flanaess develops. Having Iuz released as part of an adventure similarly strikes me as much more interesting than having players hear about it as an event in the past. Could release a pre-Citadel setting and the first uber-campaign involves Iuz' release. The canon dates for both could be adjusted to fit the new setting. Maybe set things at 550 CY? Have Iuz released in 560 CY? Maybe the Citadel and Circle form thereafter in consequence or maybe not? Tie Iuz' premature release to the Tovag Baragu event or some similar McGuffin?
I'm half convinced it is at least as likely that when GH next sees publication that it will be a restart as that it will push the present timeline forward. 4e changes could certainly be better explained (if anyone has the presence of mind to understand that is advisable) by a restart linked to some Tovag Baragu-like event. That way you tip you hat to canon while you clear the decks for action uninhibited by canon at the same time.
I'd personally still favor continuing the present timeline by 25 to 50 years but I can now see that a restart might not be automatically garbage. YMMV. _________________ GVD
As a side note, I take it, Rip, that when you write Star Wars, you mean Star Trek...Mixing the two might be interesting, but the time frames are too far apart to know what a combination of the two would look like ...You know, "Along time ago in a galaxy far, far away"...
Kwint
Whoops, yeah. One has Wookiees, the other has Vulcans. I don't usually get them confused. Wookiees are much hairier.
What would creating an "alternate Oerth" accomplish? That's the real question. The problem, I think, is that the most vocal people don't want another version - they want the original. No more, no less. The most frequent complaint I hear is that the GH wars "took away the grey" and made Greyhawk black-and-white, which is one of the most subjective statements ever, and you simply couldn't make a change without someone criticizing it as polarizing GH.
So, while I think it'd be a fun idea, I don't think it'd fly as an official canon action.
Kirk's history was altered significantly in the new Trek as "Old" Spock tells him that in his time line his dad lived and was the reason Kirk joined Star Fleet.
So, yes the events that begin the movie do change the time line and change Kirk and Spock's motivations and relationships.
****End of movie spoilers****
So, a Star Trek reboot is OK but my concept of a Battlestar Galactica reboot was a bad idea? Either way you are changing canon (how much depends on how far back you go). I am actually moving off the idea of a reboot that uses EGG PCs and the PCs of his group.
My thinking right now is take the time line back to the WoG Folio/Box Set, make some adventures, and let my players determine the tone and direction of the campaign. I want them to become the Tensors and Mordys of my Greyhawk.
If WotC writes a new Greyhawk they have a vested interest in keeping their IP alive so I doubt that Mordy and Co. are going away. So, my idea is something I will do personally at best.
I have a similar point of view regarding both the recent Star Trek reboot as well as the Battlestar Galactica reboot. Both are well put together. But they fail to represent what I liked about the both of them initially. They are not what I ordered, I wanted a cheeseburger and I got a fish sandwich. I won't say they are bad, they are just not what I wanted.
I think Star Trek, Battlestar Galactica, and Greyhawk are as good now as they were originally. I don't think changing them is necessary. After all, the only reason I can think of a reboot for Greyhawk would be a financial one. I mean, why not call Battlestar Galactica on Sci-Fi a totally different show?
I do like some remakes, but by and large I would rather have something new to love than something new that is flawed by my comparing it with an older version of itself; an older version that has had years to burrow deep within my reckoning.
That being said, I am a hypocrite for liking the Dragon Quest remake games.
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...You know, "Along time ago in a galaxy far, far away"...
