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    Canonfire :: View topic - The Monastic Order of the Ebon Rose
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    The Monastic Order of the Ebon Rose
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    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:01 pm  
    The Monastic Order of the Ebon Rose

    This is a pretty lengthy post, and will probably have to be divided into a couple sections. This is a monastic order that I use in my Greyhawk campaign. A few caveats, first of all the Pale is no longer a Theocracy. Many moons ago, my first DM (way back in the '80s) introduced me to Greyhawk, but it was a Greyhawk that he had made changes to. Part of those changes was that the Pale was run by the Church of Hextor, who had kicked the Church of Pholtus out of their lands a couple of hundred years back (and they are STILL ticked about it). Well, throughout that campaign, and others that followed, one of their loyal monks (a fellow by name of Arminas--you can guess who played him, lol) eventually led an uprising that cast the Church of Hextor out. After that, the Pale rejected church based leadership, which upset several religions (including Hextor, Pholtus, Heironious, St. Cuthbert, among ohters).

    The second major change was that the Pale's population was predominately Suel in origin. During the Pholtan and Hextorian regimes, they were very much 2nd-class citizens to their Oeridarian overlords, but now they have once again resumed control.

    Third, and this is little embrassing Embarassed when I first did all of this, I owned NO Greyhawk material. And I remembered my DM calling the capital of the Pale Wintershaven, not Wintershiven. But at least it is an easy way to remember this is not from canon Greyhawk!

    The Order of the Ebon Rose is not restricted to my version of the Pale, however. Feel free to use it in whatever setting that you want, and above, enjoy the game.

    Master Arminas


    Last edited by masterarminas on Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:39 pm; edited 3 times in total
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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:02 pm  

    The Order of the Ebon Rose
    A Monastic Order for the World of Greyhawk


    The Order of the Ebon Rose was founded in C.Y. 569 by Arminas tar Valantil, in the city of Wintershaven, in the Pale (formerly known as the Theocracy of). The Ebon Rose is a monastic order with members dedicated to perfecting their bodies and spirits. But not all residents of a monastic Chapterhouse are of the monk class.

    A typically Chapterhouse of the Ebon Rose will have between 20 and 50 residents, of which no more than one-quarter to one-third will actually be monks. Non-monk residents are referred to as “Noviates”. These residents have taken no oaths, nor have they received training as monks. They have, however, agreed to abide by the rules of the Order while living on the Order’s grounds. Noviates come from all walks of life, with some being wizards, others fighters, a few rogues, though most are commoners and experts. Life within the walls of a Chapterhouse is orderly and well-maintained. Each resident, monk or Noviate, is expected to contribute to the maintaining of the Chapterhouse, and aid in the work done there.

    All Chapterhouses have a library, since knowledge is of vital importance to the Order. Noviates with backgrounds in scholarly pursuits are often assigned to work in the library, organizing and cataloging works, as well as scribing copies. Chapterhouses contain extensive fields, since all food eaten by the residents is grown or raised by the Chapterhouse. All residents, whether monks or Noviates, work the fields, tend the herds, and otherwise care for the land. They also maintain the buildings of the Chapterhouse. Many Chapterhouses include a winery upon the property, as well as a cheese-aging house. Wine and cheese are frequently sold to provide income for the Chapterhouse and the Order.

    An important part of each Chapterhouse is the Refectory. This building is where monks are actually taught. It typically includes an area open to the sky where weapons training is handled. All weapons of the Chapterhouse are stored in the Refectory, and the building itself is open at all hours to those who wish to mediate or to practice. Even Noviates are free to enter the Refectory and undergo training. As a sign of trust, there are no locks on any door, window, or other enclosure at a Chapterhouse, other than the vaults. Only the vaults buried beneath each Chapterhouse are locked; so that the secrets of the Order remain safe from the prying eyes of the world at large.

    Life at the Chapterhouse begins an hour before dawn, with the first ringing of the bells (“Prime”). All Noviates and monks rise, take a small amount of time for personal hygiene, go through a half-hour of physical calisthenics, and then begin their daily assignments, given the night before by the Master of the Chapterhouse. Typically, the Chapterhouse and grounds are thoroughly cleaned, and the animals being raised for milk, eggs, and meat are tended to. The second ringing of the bells (“Seconde”) signals the call to break fast for the morning meal, two hours after dawn. Once the morning meal has been partaken, the residents return to their assigned duties; some to the fields, some to the archives, some to continue work on the buildings, etc.

    At noon, the third ringing occurs (“Tierce”), signaling all residents that the noon meal is to be served. Once this meal is eaten, all within the Chapterhouse have a brief period of time during which they may do as they please, until the fourth ringing (“Quartre”). Quartre occurs three hours after noon, and signals all monks to report to the Refectory for the days training and sparring sessions. Noviates continue with their assigned duties.

    The fifth ringing of the bell (“Quinte”) signals the evening meal, and is rung at sun-down. Once the meal is eaten, residents have a free period of time to themselves, though Noviates are encouraged to meditate, and monks are encouraged to practice their skills, or increase their knowledge. The sixth ringing of the bell (“Sexte”) comes two hours after sundown, and alerts the residents that they must return to their individual cells to sleep. Only those residents’ assigned duties during the night remain out of their cells. Sleep is encouraged, but not required. So long as the resident remains in his cell, he may meditate, study, or read as he wishes. The seventh and final ringing of the bell (“Septe”) occurs at mid-night, and lets those who hear it know the residents are aware and watching.

    All Chapterhouses are governed by a Master of the Order (12th level or higher monk) assigned to that specific Chapterhouse by the High Masters of the Order in Wintershaven. Regardless of his specific ranking within the order, all save the High Masters and the Grand Master answer to the Master of the Chapterhouse within which they reside, even if they are senior to the Master of the Chapterhouse. Visitors may stay for as long as two days and one night at the Chapterhouse without any fee, being fed, and not expected to participate in the daily routine. After that, however, they must become Noviates or are expelled (exceptions are made for the seriously wounded, as well as children, women with child, and the mad, as well as invited guests).

    All Chapterhouses report directly to the Mother Chapterhouse, located in Wintershaven. The Mother Chapterhouse, also known as the Fortress of the Ebon Rose, is located on a small island in a tiny lake, just outside of Wintershaven. At least 600 residents—one quarter actual monks—live on the island, caring for the Monastic Fortress and tilling the fields surrounding the lake. The Council of High Masters and the Grand Master of the Order reside here, and here is contained all the documents and reports of every Chapterhouse in existence. Like all Chapterhouses, the Monastic Fortress is open to all whom come to its doors, but security is very high, due to the large numbers of mid-to-high level monks residing here.

    All actual members of the monastery (monks), as well as many Noviates, are expected to keep daily logs or journals while traveling or adventuring. These logs are returned to the Monastic Fortress via the Chapterhouses and are kept as a file on the individual in question. The logs are available to all residents, who frequently use monks and Noviates logs as reference material.

    Joining the Order of the Ebon Rose is quite simple—one must be taught the simple, but effective, fighting style for which the monastery is known and then take the Oath. The Oath is taken for life—once one joins the Order he is expected to abide by its rules until the day of his death. Oath-breakers are pursued until proof of their death is acquired. Because of this, the Order will not allow the Oath to be taken until the candidate for membership is thoroughly questioned, as well as both physically and mentally tested for fitness. If a candidate is deemed acceptable to the Master of the Chapterhouse, he is made a Brother-Probationer for a period of at least four weeks—though in at least one known case, it lasted for six months. During this time, the Brother-Probationer is taught the core beliefs of the Order—the Strictures and Morals of the Order of the Ebon Rose. He is pushed to his physical and mental limits, and his moral and spiritual self are also tested and probed. During this period, the Brother-Probationer can withdraw his candidacy without any penalty—other than never being able to join the Order afterwards.

    After the Master of the Chapterhouse and other senior monks deem the Brother-Probationer adequately prepared to take his place among the Order, the Brother-Probationer is given the Rite of Dawn. In a ceremony that lasts for one full day, the Brother-Probationer is questioned publicly by three senior monks of the Chapterhouse before all residents of the Chapterhouse—monks and Noviates alike. The Master of the Chapterhouse presides—but asks no questions and utters no sound. Once the Questioning is completed, the Brother-Probationer is taken to the baths, where his clothing is removed, his hair is cut, his body shaved, and he is bathed. He is given new clothing—never worn by any other—and escorted to the Refractory. Here, he must fight. Fifteen of the residents are present (these may be monks or Noviates). He fights them individually, until he prevails or he falls. No rest is given during the fights—the Brother-Probationer immediately begins his next upon completion of the current one. If he fails to defeat even a single opponent, then he is cast out from the Order. If he defeats one, he is given another four weeks to prepare and the Rite ends. He must defeat two of his opponents to be accepted as a Brother of the Order. For every opponent defeated after the first two, he gains additional respect from the monks and Noviates. To defeat seven or more is a sign that the new Brother is destined for greatness. Very few defeat more than seven—only once in the history of the Order has any Brother-Probationer defeated 11. None have triumphed over more than that.

    Following the fights, the Brother-Probationer is once more bathed, his wounds tended, and he is dressed in white linen robes. He is not allowed to eat, but may have water. Then, he is escorted to the Chapel, where he is expected to remain in meditation until the crack of dawn the following morning. At dawn, all of the bells of the Chapterhouse are rung, the doors of the Chapel flung open, and the Master of the Chapterhouse escorts the new Brother once more to the baths. There, the Master himself bathes the Brother, and gives him his new attire. He is dressed, and exits into the Courtyard a full member of the Order. There—in the presence of all monks and Noviates—the Master of the Chapterhouse administers the Oath.


    Last edited by masterarminas on Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:26 pm  

    Ranks and Hierarchies

    All members of the Order can be addressed as Brother (or Sister). However, once a monk as attained 9th level as a monk, he earns the title of Master. Each class level attained thereafter has a formal title associated with it, but the monk can still be addressed as Master So-and-So.

    10th level: Superior Master
    11th level: Master of Dragons
    12th level: Master of the North Watch
    13th level: Master of the South Watch
    14th level: Master of the West Watch
    15th level: Master of the East Watch
    16th level: Master of Winter
    17th level: Master of Autumn
    18th level: Master of Summer
    19th level: Master of Spring
    20th level: Grand Master

    It is the tradition of the Order of the Ebon Rose that upon attaining one of these ranks, a monk must fight and defeat another who has attained the same level of skill. Success by the monk grants him the respect of his superiors (and subordinates) in the Order, while failing at the task conveys disappointment, and often heralds less prestigious assignments.

    Although tradition, it is not required; indeed, some adventuring monks might well go years without seeing a Chapter-House or having the opportunity to engage in these bouts. But it is expected that the monk find a way to comply with tradition as soon as he can after attaining one of these levels.

    The only exception is the rank of Grand Master, which is held by a 20th level or higher monk. To be confirmed in that rank, a monk must successfully defeat a Master of Spring in single combat--otherwise, the cantidate remains a Master of Spring. There can be (and sometimes are) multiple Grand Masters. The senior of these is the Grand Master of the Order of the Ebon Rose.

    Any Grand Master can challenge the current Grand Master of the Order for his posistion; defeating him conveys the title onto the challenger. Once the new monk is installed as Grand Master of the Order, he is immune to further challenges for a period of two weeks.

    If the Grand Master of the Order dies or resigns his posistion, then all Grand Masters who wish to stand for the post participate in series of fights, until only one remains, who has earned the right to the title.


    Last edited by masterarminas on Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:47 pm; edited 4 times in total
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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 7:33 pm  

    The Stricture and Morals of the Order of the Ebon Rose

    The Strictures and Morals of the Order of the Ebon Rose are the paths of conduct and regulations of actions. These rules serve as the moral and ethical guidelines for all who observe them. Those who take the Oath as a member of the Ebon Rose swear to honor these ideals and philosophies in all things, even at the cost of their own life—or soul.

    The First Moral Dictum of Arminas tar Valantil

    Creation is the absolute moral imperative of all living creatures. We exist only to create—to propagate, to ensure the continuity of our kind. By the act of creation—though it may take many forms; such as the quickening of a child, the construction of a vast complex of buildings, the carving of a simple staff, or the education of those who are without knowledge—we sow the seeds of the future. Destruction is not the antithesis of creation, for we recognize that all things perish and crumble in the depths of time. However, destruction for the sake of pleasure, of sadistic delight; purposeless and senseless destruction just because we can; that is the road that leads to Chaos. We are, at times, called upon to fulfill the promise of all living creatures, by assisting them to their final end. We shall never do so without cause or reason, or for personal gain or pleasure. Those who do so, shall be judged by the Masters of the Order, and sentenced to exile within the very realms of Chaos which they have sowed.

    In order to create, and to destroy when required, one must have Power. The goal of the Order is to guide those who have eyes to see and ears to listen, and souls which seek out for knowledge to increase their own stores and reservoirs of power. By so doing, we form a bulwark between our people and the tyranny of Chaos, as represented by the many, many misguided souls of our world. This is not to say that one must only use power for good. Good—and Evil alike—are nothing more than conceptions forced upon Man by those from without. While servants of both exist as pure beacons of each force, Man is neither inherently Good, nor is he Evil. We are both, and yet simultaneously neither. We have the potential to outshine the mightiest beacon of Celestia and to humble the proudest denizen of the Pits. We are concerned nary with either concept, but only with Chaos and Law. For it is within the boundaries of Law that people are able to grow, to express themselves, to learn and to eventually lead, to create. Always, and forever, it shall be the purpose of this Order to form a dam against the tide of Chaos, so to shield behind us the green valley of Man.

    The First Stricture and Regulation: Power

    All living, thinking beings possess some degree of Power, however insignificant. The Order recognizes this and encourages its members to increase their own inner power. Life, in the philosophy of the Order, is about the accumulation of Power. In the words of the Founder “Power used not is Power which wastes away”, and this ideal is propagated throughout the monastery. All creatures have some degree of Power, specifically the Power to create and to destroy. The Order encourages the former and discourages the latter. Only through the Power of creation does mankind expand his horizons, and with each creation Power increases at an exponential rate. Destruction, on the other hand, should never be done purely for the sake of destruction, for down that path lays the madness of Chaos. Sometimes, destruction of a foe is the only answer, but it should never be the first answer. Always, a student of the Ebon Rose must balance his acts of destruction against his acts of creation. “For each that we destroy, we must renew and restore, create anew; lest in our arrogance, we fall to the trap of pride and the ways of Chaos”, thus sayeth the Founder.

    The Second Moral Dictum of Arminas tar Valantil

    Power without purpose is as barren and wasted as soil without water. It is a desert which appears without life—awaiting the rain that will cause it to bloom and prosper. That purpose is Responsibility. We of this Order of brothers and sisters are the keepers of our own fate and destiny. It is our purpose in life to guide, to protect, to educate, and—when necessary—to cull those around us. We are the Keepers of Order and the Guardians against Chaos. Yet, in our duties to others, we also have duties to self—to act with honor at all times, and in all things—to shirk no burden for fear of death or failure—to act decisively when action is called for. We bear a heavy duty, my brothers and sisters, for it is our destiny to shepherd Man to a better way of life. To accomplish this goal, we must become the keepers of Man’s honor and fate. The power we wield must be used to further our goals and to create a society in which all shall share in the honor, and the glory, and the liberty that are the gifts of Providence to all Mankind.

    There are those among us whom it is our special task to care for. Those who have not yet matured enough, in body or soul, to understand or to act—these you shall protect even at the cost of your own honor. Those who bear children as yet unborn—these shall your hand shield from blows, even at the price of your own life’s blood. Those who are driven mad by the vagaries of fate or, perhaps, the too clear perception of knowledge—these you shall comfort and guide and allow no Man, no creature of the darkest fieriest Hells to harm, though it cost you your own soul immortal.

    For—through this—we shall preserve and protect our people, as the shepherd guides and guards his flock; that they may, in time, turn the desert of the soul of Man to gentle pastures, filled with orchards and streams, with life and power forevermore.

    The Second Stricture and Regulation: Responsibility

    “Without Responsibility, Power is worse than useless, it is Chaos”, so sayeth the Founder. Indeed, so Responsibility is the second of the Strictures. We, each of us, are responsible for a great many duties. Duty to your brothers and sisters of the Order, duty to those around us, duty to your own self—these are all the burden of being a member of the Ebon Rose. “Death is lighter than a feather, but Duty is heavier than a mountain,” quoted the Founder many years ago. And it is true today. As a member of the Order, your duty, your Responsibility is, and always will be, to others. Whether it is protecting them, or guiding them, or teaching them, or executing them, your duty will be clear as long as you stay true to the Order.

    In addition, we of the Order are charged with the special protection of three distinct groups of innocents: children who are not yet of the age of adulthood, women who are with child, and those who are mad and insane. Suffer none of these to see harm in your presence, and avenge them wholly and thoroughly—as swiftly and ruthlessly as possible—that no one will attempt any action against them without knowing the fate their actions shall provoke. Should one of our Order be the one to raise hand versus those protected by this Stricture—in any action other than defense of himself or others, in order to spare more lives or spirits than would be otherwise be lost—then he shall be proclaimed anathema, and hunted to the end of his days by all who honor the words of the Founder. He shall suffer a fate a thousand times worse—for a thousand days longer—before his soul is sent screaming into the Limbo of Chaos. Should this stricture you disregard, kill yourself before the Order finds you, for mercy shall not be forthcoming.

    The Third Moral Dictum of Arminas tar Valantil

    Power and Responsibility are two of the three towers of our philosophy. Yet, without the third, Honor, it is nothing more than an unstable construction that must, inevitably, fall. Belief in yourself—in the code which you carry within you, in your own personal sense of Honor—that is what steadies all of us to our duty. In all things, brothers and sisters, perform your duties with stout heart and with Honor.

    Those who are without Honor are the servants of Chaos. They seek nothing more than their own heart’s desire, without regard for the consequences of their actions. Even if it means your doom, hold fast to the Honor of your own soul, and others will see the beacon which you grant to the world around you. Yet, only a fool yields to his foe more ground than must be offered. To those who have no Honor, you are bound only to act within the constraints of your own Honor—you are free to speak fabrications and falsehoods unto them, but be warned, sometimes the best lie of all is silence. A wise man knows when to speak, and when to listen, when to foster belief in that which is not true, and when to smile at a foe who has opened himself to deliverance into thine own crushing embrace.

    But to those who act with Honor of their own—even if they do not hold with the philosophy and tenets of this Order—to these you shall treat as would a brother or a sister. Destroy them if you must, but speak only your own Honors worth to them, and seek to deceive them not. For a time will come, when Honor shall recognize like Honor and perhaps—in the fullness of time—such a one-time foe may become an ally in this, our war eternal against Chaos. For though they stand outside our dedicated Order, they too, in this world serve a purpose, as indeed do all living creatures.

    Hold fast always to your given word—give it forth not lightly, for it shall bind you surer than any Oath. Though it means you take arms against the very Order itself, stand always for your Honor, for your word, for your duty. You will be respected for it, and uplifted because of it. Even more critical to my soul, and to your soul, and unto the spirits of our well-reckoned dead, speak only truth to yourself. Honor only comes from understanding your own being, from never deceiving your own spirit—whether by accepting something you know is false, or by allowing an action to take place by knowing it wrong, or even condemning a hated foe by standing silent and not speaking forth the truth. Honor to those around us is simple, but Honor—true Honor—to one’s own inner self; that is the task which is difficult. But, if you accept these teachings, it is the one thing which counts above all others. Without a spine of steel, stiffened by courage, tempered with the white hot core of your souls fierce forge—without your own inner Honor—your words and actions are meaningless, your life naught more than a lie.

    The Third Stricture and Regulation: Honor

    All members of the Order are expected and required to act with Honor, both in their personal lives and in their public demeanor. Honor is vital to the ideals of the Order. Those who are members of the Order are prohibited from discourteous behavior and from speaking falsely to brothers and sisters of the Order, from slander and from all activities which might—in the light of day—cast forth a shadow upon our names. You are expected and required to treat those who possess Honor with Honor and justice. Those who are beneath your station, who have professed no Honor, or who have proven themselves honorless, to these you are free to take whatever action suits you, and is appropriate to the situation. The stricture of Honor applies not to such vermin, and you are to eradicate them with neither mercy nor remorse when you uncover them.

    The Fourth and Final Moral Dictum of Arminas tar Valantil

    Power . . . Responsibility . . . Honor . . . these words are the core of what we here live by. But one more is required. One more is needed to temper the finely honed steel that you—my brothers and sisters of the soul—have become. And that word—that concept—is Respect. Always—in every situation you may encounter—grant Respect to those who have earned the right. To those appointed above you, to those who are superior in fact (if not in rank), to those whom it is your pride to stand beside in open battle. They have earned the right for your Respect, and it is a stain upon your own Honor to deny them that which they have earned through the exercise of their own Power, and Responsibility, and Honor.

    Demand the Respect of those beneath you, not through words of scorn, but of actions performed. For when you earn their Respect, you will find that not only will your methods be enhanced; you will inspire those to follow you in the Path of Ascension. By your deeds, you shall meld and mold Mankind into that which shall never again need fear Deity or Demon, but shall make the planes themselves quake in dread at the merest thought that we choose to tread there. We shall—in that time—stride forth both confident and unafraid, secure in the power that we have harnessed, not merely for ourselves, but for all Man—and fashion for Us a place that may never be destroyed.

    My sisters and brothers, I cannot emphasize enough the crisis that you are about to enter. You have tread the paths of power, become more than mortal man ever dreamed, pushed yourself beyond the limits of mortal comprehension, and transcended unto a higher existence. You have found yourself bound by duty, and by honor, to those who rest weary under the protection of your outstretched hand, to those who ask for your vigilance and courage, to those who cannot defend themselves, and yet can not ask to be defended. But, all this, is nothing, NOTHING! For without Respect, for life, for Man—above all for yourself—you shall become sterile, incapable of creating and Law itself will melt down into the anarchy of Chaos. This is my final lesson to you, my children of the mind: with Respect, you shall attain greatness. Without it, you are nothing more than the betraying hand of Chaos, cloaked within a disguise of Law and Order.

    The Fourth and Final Stricture and Regulation: Respect

    The Founder held this as one of the most important tenets of our philosophy: to show Respect where earned, to show kindness and compassion to those beneath us, to earn the Respect both of our betters and our lessers. You must learn this lesson, and learn it well, for it is the price of Power that it seeks to corrupt the wielder, that he may become the embodiment of Chaos incarnate. Only with the testing of your spirit and soul can you become transcendent—but only with the knowledge and forethought to respect your life, your self, your world, and all living creatures can you truly create. Should you reject this stricture, you are nothing but the Abomination which strives to destroy us all, and quickly shall you find your fate judged.
    GreySage

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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 8:36 pm  

    Excellent post, masterarminas! Again I say, this is the kind of post you should be submitting as an article for the front page. Wink

    I have one quibble, which I'd like to discuss.

    "There are those among us whom it is our special task to care for. Those who have not yet matured enough, in body or soul, to understand or to act—these you shall protect even at the cost of your own honor. Those who bear children as yet unborn—these shall your hand shield from blows, even at the price of your own life’s blood. Those who are driven mad by the vagaries of fate or, perhaps, the too clear perception of knowledge—these you shall comfort and guide and allow no Man, no creature of the darkest fieriest Hells to harm, though it cost you your own soul immortal."

    I've bolded the parts which I believe contradict the other strictures and moral dictums of the Order.

    I understand giving up one's life for one's beliefs, but the Order is all about transcending oneself (one's own soul) to a penultimate state of being. I'm not sure that such an order would truly prescribe sacrificing one's own soul (if it was even possible to do so) for any mortal cause. Nor do I believe that this Order would ever condone a member's compromising of his or her honor for any mortal cause. This is spelled out quite clearly in the following statement:

    "Though it means you take arms against the very Order itself, stand always for your Honor, for your word, for your duty."

    So, I'm asking if you agree that the above is worded incorrectly by implying that the Order would expect a member to sacrifice their soul or honor, or am I misunderstanding part(s) of the Strictures and Moral Dictums as a whole?

    SirXaris
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    Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:33 pm  

    The first one should have probably read something like at the cost of your perceived honor (i.e. reputation and standing). And the second? Well, there is only so many ways to say put your on the line without getting overly repetitive. Happy

    I was trying to keep the same voice, if you will, for the writer of the Morals versus the instructions of the Strictures. And, you will notice, here are some differences between the two. For example, that same Moral. The Stricture following turns right around and allows you to harm one belonging to those categories--under certain conditions. But is it really a contradiction?

    The first section of each is what the Founder said, while the second is what the Order has codified into law. Not a lot of difference between the two, but there is some as time has passed and the Founder hasn't been around for decades. Over time, the Order has softened some of his original founding philosophy--and if the leader's could get away with removing that part about 'though it means taking up arms against the Order itself' they would. Unfortunately, they can't because it is already common knowledge.

    But there is definatively some conflict built into the reading and response (to use a Methodist thing) and that was intentional.

    Hope that answers your questions.

    MA
    GreySage

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    Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:36 am  

    masterarminas wrote:
    But there is definatively some conflict built into the reading and response (to use a Methodist thing) and that was intentional.

    Hope that answers your questions.

    MA


    It does, yes. I hadn't picked up on that, so thank you for pointing out the purposefulness of such conflicting statements. I felt there were a few more, but didn't want to study the entire document sufficiently to discover them. It does make it more interesting for a player who is considering having his character join the Order, though. Nice job. Smile

    SirXaris
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    Wed Nov 02, 2011 8:15 pm  

    I agree with Sir Xaris this would of made a nice article. If you have more stuff like this you want to share submit it and we all can enjoy this on the front page.

    Nice Post!

    Later

    Argon
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    Wed Nov 02, 2011 9:00 pm  

    Thanks, Argon. I'll be around for a while, got some other things I am working on, but am finally getting back to my Greyhawk roots now that I have found Pathfinder. You couldn't pay me to play 4th edition.

    Master Arminas
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    Wed Nov 02, 2011 11:54 pm  

    You should post this, and similar offerings, as Articles, with discussion to follow the in the Readers Workshop forum. That way you will have a better format for the presentation of your writing, and you will get some front page action too. Wink Don't be shy. Everyone is encouraged to submit articles for the front page. You may submit any articles that you wish to HERE.
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