So I'm familiar with the rules for quickly donning armor - such as if you are awakened from sleep and need to jump into a fray. But why not sleep in the armor? I'm not suggesting this is sensible, I'm trying to anticipate my players since I have a couple of nighttime ambushes planned for them. Are their any penalties for sleeping in armor? Does anyone have any historical references of why Knights would or wouldn't sleep in armor? And would all armor be sleep prohibited? Would it be more likely that someone could sleep in chainmail, but not platemail? Just wondering - thanks! _________________ No place is safe, only safer.
3.5e and Pathfinder have specific rules regarding sleeping in armor. To the best of my recollection, a character sleeping in medium or heavy armor begins the next day Fatigued and remains that way until they get a good night's rest (unemcumbered with armor). Being Fatigued gives a character a -2 penalty on all To Hit rolls and penalties to other ability checks as well. Plus, it is easier to become Exhausted, which prevents a character from doing anything much at all.
I'm sorry, but I don't recall if earlier editions had such rules written into them.
In real life, it was possible to sleep in one's armor, but it wasn't all that comfortable, so the above penalties seem to be appropriate for someone paranoid enough to want to keep their armor on all night.
Oh, there is also a Feat in 3.5e that allows a character to sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued. Endurance is the Feat.
As to historical/real life references, knights donned armor only when battle was imminent for a few reasons.
1. It is heavy, and does tire you out.
2. It is hot as hell. A suit of armor is a portable oven. Let's just say that it is designed to protect, but not to breathe (in terms of fabric breathing) well at all. Armor traps in heat well, and it makes you sweat like a pig. Now, add physical exertion to the mix. Ah yes, that arming coat is gonna smell real nice after a while. Kind of like what hockey pads smell like at the end of an entire season of play. You just can't ever get the smell (and sweat stains) completely out
The combined effect is exhaustion and dehydration, if one isn't smart. Sounds fun, yes?
So, that's why knights didn't just wear their armor all the time. They were smart.
Also, the 3.5 Feat Endurance allows for the wearing of Medium and Light armors without ill effect, but not Heavy armor. Even some of the Medium armor is pushing things. The 3.5/PF rules for extended wearing of armor and fatigue are decent enough, and I recommend using them. You may wish to extend the benefits of being able to sleep in Medium armors without ill effect to those characters having the 2E Nonweapon Proficiency Endurance. If you do, you may wish to use the following guidelines for 2E (based on 3.5 references):
* Leather, padded, ring mail, and studded leather armor is Light armor, and may be slept in by anyone without becoming fatigued.
* Hide, scale, brigandine, and chain mail is Medium armor, and may be slept in without fatigue by those with Endurance; anyone else doing so will become fatigued.
* Banded mail, splint mail, plate mail, bronze plate mail, field plate, and full plate are Heavy armor, and anyone sleeping in them will become fatigued.
You can use the fatigue rules from Players Options: Combat and Tactics for this, or port over the 3.5/PF rules instead. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
You can use the fatigue rules from Players Options: Combat and Tactics for this
I read up on these rules - they seem sensible enough with the exception that they don't account for leveling. Monsters get 8 fatigue points plus one per HD, but Players only get their base die plus their Con bonus. I think I'll tweak it to add a point per level. Also, you lose a point when you "move or attack" - does this include spell-casting in your mind? I suppose harnessing mystical energy would have a physical tax, but what are your thoughts?
DMPrata wrote:
The 1E Wilderness Survival Guide has some rules for sleeping in armor. You effectively lose x hours of sleep, depending on the armor.
This sounds like another excellent method of treating the issue - I'll have to get my hands on that text (they had it in my local used bookstore last time I was there) and see if it makes more sense than the fatigue rules from C&T. _________________ No place is safe, only safer.
Also, you lose a point when you "move or attack" - does this include spell-casting in your mind?
There is a system for spell casting fatigue. Depends on whether or not you want to use it though. I am not a fan of spell fatigue, as mages have less fatigue and do need to move about already, which uses fatigue. Also, any spell that uses an attack physical attack role, like a shocking grasp spell, I would make use fatigue. So, if a mage moved, cast shocking grasp, and attacked then they would use fatigue points for the move and the attack, but not the spell casting. Having it all cause fatigue would be too much I think, and mages have their own built-in weakness already. If you do use the spell fatigue system, remember that concentrating on a spell that has already been cast does not use further fatigue. Pretty sure I am remembering that correctly, but check anyways.
You mention fatigue and leveling. I think what you mention was an oversight (or I just missed it skimming the section). I mean, monsters, fighting for longer than the heroic PCs? I don't think so. I would add character levels to the PC's Fatigue total as well. For multi-class characters that would be an average of their levels, not all of their levels combined. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
I completely concur about using The Wilderness Survival Guide for a variety of reasons. Firstly, it has a chart about the quality and amount of rest characters require, including if they choose to rest in armor. Secondly, it has the effects (temperature, hit rolls, movement rates, etc) for characters wearing armor; this goes to what Ceb was saying about armor being 'hot as hell.' A character can fry if they are not careful (the use of a cleric's Resist Heat comes in rather handy on this score). Finally, there is a treasure trove of information in that amazing tome for anything and everything wilderness: weather tables, finding shelter, water requirements, you name it! It is truly one of my favorite books for the game, especially if you run a lot of outdoor campaigns!
As for character fatigue, perhaps that is for another posting of your design. I personally use fatigue in my combat games, and have added a few house rules, especially where spell-casters are noted, and would be most willing to add my 2 cents' worth...
It is truly one of my favorite books for the game, especially if you run a lot of outdoor campaigns!
As for character fatigue, perhaps that is for another posting of your design. I personally use fatigue in my combat games, and have added a few house rules, especially where spell-casters are noted, and would be most willing to add my 2 cents' worth...
-Lanthorn
I'd love to hear your feedback on fatigue. I really like the depth of info in the Wilderness Survival Guide, but as the first session with the group is this Friday, I'm going to have skip that rabbit hole for now. As it is I've put together a list of mechanics that I'm implementing and it's grown rather long. I don't want to end up tracking so many things that the story suffers - especially since I'm brand new at DM'ing. I think fatigue will be simple enough to manage. I do plan on reading enough of the Survival Guide to get a handle on weather and the effects of extreme environmental elements - as we in Virginia have recently been reminded - a good storm can be an encounter in it's own right! _________________ No place is safe, only safer.
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