Signup
Welcome to... Canonfire! World of GreyhawK
Features
Postcards from the Flanaess
Adventures
in Greyhawk
Cities of
Oerth
Deadly
Denizens
Jason Zavoda Presents
The Gord Novels
Greyhawk Wiki
#greytalk
JOIN THE CHAT
ON DISCORD
    Canonfire :: View topic - Animal Summoning Duration Limits
    Canonfire Forum Index -> Greyhawk- AD&D 2nd Edition
    Animal Summoning Duration Limits
    Author Message
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2470
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Sun Dec 01, 2013 9:18 am  
    Animal Summoning Duration Limits

    The priest spells of this name state the Duration is "Special" in that the animals stay until a specific task is done. This can truly be open-ended and lengthy in duration depending upon that task.

    For instance, a priest could order the creatures to remain as guardians until he/she had passed through a given terrain or region, or until a specific group (enemies) were slain. This could take days, maybe weeks.

    Wondering what limits you all put on the duration of these types of spells. Here are ideas I have thought of:

    1) Max duration is 1 day (hour, or even turn, perhaps?) per level of the priest.
    2) A Charisma check is required each hour, or day, with penalties accruing.
    3) The animals get a saving throw to negate the effects each hour (or day).

    ideas and input are greatly appreciated,

    Lanthorn
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Sun Dec 01, 2013 5:47 pm  

    "The animals summoned aid the caster by whatever means they possess, staying until a fight is over, a specific mission is finished, the caster is safe, he sends them away, etc."

    The spell is intended to be somewhat open-ended, but still limited. The examples show that the animal that is summoned directly helps the summoner with a task:

    "staying until a fight is over"- the animal is summoned to help in a fight, and will stay until it is over. This is really the shortest term application.

    "a specific mission is finished"- the animal is summoned to help with a mission, and will stay until it is completed or the animal is sent away. A perfect example of this application is found in the Gord novel "Saga of Old City", where Curly Greenleaf summons a bear to help him, Gord, and Gellor complete their mission in a cavern. Note that Curly doesn't summon the bear in Sunndi and then takes him across the entire Flanaess to the mission location though, but summons him from the locale of the caverns. This spell is not intended to have a priest/druid be able to summon every animal on the continent and give them a "guard me" command, with a duration of "so long as I live", obviously.

    "the caster is safe"- animal protector type of thing, but with the meaning that the caster needs to get to safety, not be kept safe forever.

    "he sends them away" - the task is undetermined, but the meaning here is that caster will send the animal back to where it belongs in a reasonable amount of time. This may differ somewhat depending on the type of animal, but not by much.

    All that being said, if this spell is used in such a way that it even remotely begins to verge into the territory of an animal friendship spell, or be used as some sort of "enslave animal" spell, such an application should be quashed. Also, somebody who summons an animal in this fashion would be morally suspect if they kept the animal from its own environment/disrupted its life cycle overly much- this isn't an animal enslavement spell. Using this spell in such a way will not doubt lead to ethos violations for a priest/druid of pretty much any non-evil deity, resulting in a loss of powers, require an atonement, etc.

    Also, removing a wild animal from its own hunting grounds for any notable length of time makes it utterly reliant on the caster for food and water. If those are not provided, I would rule that the player is an imbecile, the spell ends, and that the animal is free to leave of its own accord. Or maybe it just gets vindictive and eats the caster. Laughing

    So, use a bit of common sense here in limiting things based on the situation and the ethos of the faith of the caster.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -


    Last edited by Cebrion on Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:35 am; edited 1 time in total
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Feb 15, 2010
    Posts: 60


    Send private message
    Mon Dec 02, 2013 5:15 am  

    On the "max duration" side, I suggest about a day, maybe two--"protect the camp while we sleep"/"escort us through this section of Dread Forest"/and so on--in this way it is a limited/specific task or mission, and not nearly as flexible as animal friendship. It is also an "uncertain combat" type scenario and not a loophole to simply add another henchman to a party in any long-term fashion. An example of an unacceptable applications would be "help us clear the Caverns of Despair"--a situation in which there will obviously be multiple engagements of the enemy, and the animal would essentially be a longer term fighting henchman.
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2470
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:20 pm  

    Cebrion, I fully agree that the potential for abuse is there and it is up to the DM to curtail any possibility of that from occurring. I applaud your use of citing Gord book references (I vaguely recall that scene, in fact...didn't the bear do battle with a demon in that cavern?).

    Jtylerk, I like your max duration limit as to a day or two, based, of course, on the type of animal summoned and its natural behavior, etc.

    Thank you both for your posts.

    -Lanthorn
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:32 am  

    Yep, you have the situation correct regarding why the bear was summoned. Wink

    Overall, the duration of the animal's service should be as jtlerk said- no more than a day or two. Summoning a bear for the purpose of exploring what is thought to be a small cavern system would be one thing, but summoning a bear to travel from the surface realm to Erelhei-Cinlu would be quite another. Laughing
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2470
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:10 am  

    As a sidenote, I have made a house rules amendment to my Animal Summoning spells. I allow the spell-caster to summon 8x4 HD TOTAL animals for the first variant, thus permitting the priest to, literally, summon something like a swarm of normal rats, or entire flock of birds, etc.

    -Lanthorn
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3835
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Sun Dec 08, 2013 2:49 pm  

    As long as it is limited to small animals such as rats and crows, I see no problem with that.

    You should be careful of letting them summon wolverines, which are 3HD critters that are also +4 extra to hit just because they are vicious. Exactly how common are wolverines, and how many of them are out there anyways? Laughing
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2470
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:47 pm  

    The number of animals at any given time is largely dependent upon the type summoned. You are definitely correct about a limited number of wolverines in a given area, but a wolf or wild dog pack numbering 8+ is quite likely.

    This is where knowledge in zoology comes in handy.

    -Lanthorn
    Display posts from previous:   
       Canonfire Forum Index -> Greyhawk- AD&D 2nd Edition All times are GMT - 8 Hours
    Page 1 of 1

    Jump to:  

    You cannot post new topics in this forum
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum
    You cannot edit your posts in this forum
    You cannot delete your posts in this forum
    You cannot vote in polls in this forum




    Canonfire! is a production of the Thursday Group in assocation with GREYtalk and Canonfire! Enterprises

    Contact the Webmaster.  Long Live Spidasa!


    Greyhawk Gothic Font by Darlene Pekul is used under the Creative Commons License.

    PHP-Nuke Copyright © 2005 by Francisco Burzi. This is free software, and you may redistribute it under the GPL. PHP-Nuke comes with absolutely no warranty, for details, see the license.
    Page Generation: 0.32 Seconds