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    Canonfire :: View topic - exploration, clearing the wilds, kingdom building
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    exploration, clearing the wilds, kingdom building
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    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Tue Dec 28, 2010 11:03 pm  
    exploration, clearing the wilds, kingdom building

    I'm thinking of running a semi-sandbox sort of game, with themes of exploration, monster and bandit clearing, and kingdom building. I'll create a varied wilderness, some small towns, multiple dungeons, etc. Ambitious PCs have the chance to become the lords of a new realm- but they will have to carve it out of the wild with iron and magic.
    Out of game I will point out the opportunities for kingdom building to sell the players on that goal, and I will introduce suitable in-game elements to reinforce this. Not much more preset plot than that, though.


    It will be rather like the basic concept behind the River Kingdoms AP from Paizo, if you know that one.

    So, if you were to run something like this in GH, where would you set it? On the Darlene Map? If so, which region? Off the map? Where?

    Just curious to see what you guys suggest.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Wed Dec 29, 2010 5:51 am  

    Wild Coast or the Bandit Kingdoms were the first that came to mind for me.

    Maybe in the area just north of the Vesve near Iuz and the Nomads.

    If it were me, I would figure out as a DM where I wanted a potential new country and then go from there.
    Apprentice Greytalker

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    Wed Dec 29, 2010 9:35 am  

    Make your own small area have them become lords in that area then establish relations with the known areas.

    You might look into the brithright setting, it has a whole rules set for playing a king.
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Sep 14, 2009
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    Wed Dec 29, 2010 1:24 pm  

    I would do the Sea Barons. Make one of the small islands "Theirs" to clear-out. Dealing with demi-humans, pirates, sea monsters and so on. Kingdom wise, they would also have to deal with shipping lines and the random scarlet brotherhood stopping in Evil
    GreySage

    Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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    Wed Dec 29, 2010 3:01 pm  

    When I first read about the River Kingdoms, I immediately thought, "Oh, this is Golarion's version of the Bandit Kingdoms."
    Master Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 17, 2004
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    Wed Dec 29, 2010 3:45 pm  

    It would depend on the cultural context - you as the DM want?

    The great thing about GH is its a mish-mash of cultures. If you want to explore norse - northern barbarians. middle-east - baklunish basin. medieval europe - furyondy. The map is large enough to create fringe areas so its up to you to decide the cultural references you want to use.

    What cultural influences do you and your players enjoy - start from there - everything else follows - fun first and foremost.
    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 30, 2001
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    From: Niflheim, 9to5

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    Thu Dec 30, 2010 8:03 pm  

    If I remember correctly, the River Kingdoms area was once ruled, and then lost, and now disputed territory. There are plenty of war-torn lands that fit that description now - Bandit Kingdoms, Duchy of Tenh, Wild Coast, Almor, shattered Great Kingdom... perhaps part of the Horned Society as Iuz retreats. I can't remember if they were also sort of on the "edges of the map" in frontier lands. If so, Blackmoor, or areas along the Ket/Geoff/Yeomany line near the mountains and disputed with giants or the Baklunish.

    Don
    GreySage

    Joined: Oct 06, 2008
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    Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:37 am  

    I keep thinking somewhere along the coast of Medegia. The lands are laid waste, but human communities still exist, though plagued by bandits.

    Your "heroes" could liberate a coastal town from such a bandit lord/group and become the new "rulers" of the surrounding area. Being on the coast would allow for trade and travel without the need to traverse Ahlissa.

    It also allows for a mutual aid and defense "pact" with Rel Astra and the Solnor Compact. Lord Drax is looking to establish a buffer zone between himself and Ahlissa, why not a buffer state instead? Wink

    Just something to think about.
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    Adept Greytalker

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    Fri Dec 31, 2010 4:18 pm  

    I would think the Bone March or the Pomarj would be good candidates as well. No other organized power would contest it, there are plenty of bad guys to fight, and the characters would be kept plenty busy conducting CHB (clear-hold-build) throughout. The latter also sits on some mineral resources, though I do not recall if the former has much going for it.
    Master Greytalker

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    Sat Jan 01, 2011 12:35 pm  

    tarelton wrote:
    I would think the Bone March or the Pomarj would be good candidates as well. No other organized power would contest it


    I think Despot Turrosh Mak within the Pomarj would contest it Wink

    The two areas mentioned have other advantages; the players can present themselves as liberators to the locals and the surrounding nations might even offer limited material support.

    Pomarj has the added bonus of significant mineral resources but of course the reason for the operation would be to save the poor oppressed population - Operation Pomarj Freedom.

    Bone March has little of interest other then the fact that no one else would much care if the players carved out lands for themselves. At least until the players proved they could make them productive then a minor GK noble could turn up with an ancient document to claim those lands. Of course the numerous humanoid tribes are not going to roll over as a tribe could come over the hill to burn down their accomplishments.
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
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    Sun Jan 02, 2011 5:03 pm  

    Bone March would be easier to take down, mainly as it is more geographically contained, but also because the humanoid presence there is a fraction of what it is in the Pomarj. And the Wild Cost lords(slavers and other) are also not known for their love of being lorded over, so trouble could arise there too. It would also be counter to Scarlet Brotherhood interest, so mucking about in the Pomarj might draw them in as well. Overall, the Pomarj is a much bigger can of worms.
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    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Fri Jan 07, 2011 8:34 pm  

    Thanks for all the feedback, guys! It has been helpful.

    After talking with my players, looking over the various published sources I plan to use, etc.-I've decided to set the game in the Bandit Kingdoms.

    I'm going to run this with either B/X or AD&D 2E ( without a ton of splatbooks/extra rules).


    In Kingmaker, the PCs are given a charter by the Sword Lords of Brevoy. IMC, they will be hired as mappers/scouts/bandit busters by the rulers of the Shield Lands.

    As usual, I am ignoring pretty much all metaplot that came after the 1983 boxed set. Whatever does shake out will probably diverge a lot from 'canon-hawk.'
    Adept Greytalker

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    Mon Jan 10, 2011 8:38 am  
    B/X and C

    If you're going to run B/X rules, you may want to look at what is listed in the Companion boxed set for "dominion" rules. If you have access to it, you may want to see how those compare to the OD&D rules since they differ in ways that are interesting (they're looser). I can't remember which booklet though or what it's called in the booklets.
    Journeyman Greytalker

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    Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:49 am  

    Ah, ch-ch-changes!

    My players asked for Pathfinder, so I'm going to use that instead of B/X. My friend Tony (out of town, not playing) gave me several PF books for Christmas, so I'm cool with this change.

    The first player to make a PC made an elf druid of Telchur. Her character, and the damn big drifts we’ve had here in CT of late, got me to thinking of cold regions of the Flanaess.

    I'm going to do something odd and run post-GH Wars for the first time ever. Some details of the wars will be changed, no doubt.


    Blackmoor as written up in the LGG works even better than the B.K. for my purposes. Reasons why:

      poorly charted wilderness: the land is probably even wilder than the pretty darned wild Bandit Kingdoms

      Multiple ruined/unclaimed under baronies= perfect opportunity for kingdom building, claiming and clearing a domain

      Iuz= he avoids the area and only sends raiders in, not armies

      Some pulp sci fi stuff= yeah, Temple of the Frog & City of the Gods!

      Proximity to the Land of Black Ice= always wanted to use it, never have

      Wastri and toad cults= you know, it aint easy being green :)

      Tribal neighbors: I like the Wolf Nomads and the Rovers, and I've always wanted to do something with the Uirtag. I think at least one of my players will really enjoy in-character dealings with those groups.



    I've read through the sparse 'official GH info' on Blackmoor, and am now hashing out my own version. I'll incorporate elements from Golarion's country of Numeria. It's tagged as a 'savage land of superscience.' I'll adapt the sinister 'Technic League' as a society of Aerdi (mostly) magic-users who are working with the Egg of Coot- or I'll just replace the Egg with the Technic League. I'll keep the orcs in Blackmoor Town, and the qullans, as described in the LGG. I may also use some stuff from the B/X modules set in Blackmoor. Not sure how I will use 'Oerthmagic' but it and the standing stones associated with it will make some sort of appearance in the campaign.


    For the human ethnic groups, I have this :

      Numerians: the Flan natives, bronze skinned people. The stereotypical Numerian is a half-civilized bog dwelling fisherman, hunter, etc. Wilderness survival skills are valued highly.

      Furans (let's hope that there are no chem majors in the group:) ) : descendants of the men of Old Ferrond, a fair skinned Oerid/Suel mix, they tend to tan easily. The sterotypical Furan is a farmer-pioneer, or a town-dwelling tradesman. Farming, crafts ( esp. smithing), and fighting skills are valued highly.

      Aerdi: similiar in looks to Furans but often more of an olive complexion. Aerdi stereotypes include the intriguer, sage, star-gazer, magician, priest, ec. Aerdi are the least numerous of the three major ethnic groups.
      Letters and the arts, both mundane and mystical, are valued highly
    .

    These three groups have mixed together over time, of course, and so the traits and appearnces described above should be taken only as generalizations.

    Other groups show up, of course. One might encounter Uirtags, Wolf Nomad hunters, Rover refugees, Tenha mercenaries, Oerids of the Bandit Kingdoms, a scattering of Zeai Suel, etc.
    edit- Cavemen are listed on the encounter table for BM in the Glossography. Definitely going to include them!



    Notes on religion:

    Tsath? = I don't think that Wastri will be known as 'Wastri' in these lands. I may use 'Tsath' as a reference to Tsathuggua. Saint Toad? Mystara has a nasty toad-like immortal named Stodos, Lord of the Icy Wastes, which could work well if I decide to use ice toads as followers of the toad-god.

    Other gods: I'm not sure yet. There will likely be few large temples. Instead, most towns have small shrines to various common, Flan, and Oerdian gods. It may be common to find very small shrines or 'god cabinets' in homes. Pilgrims criss cross the countryside. travelling among holy sites.
    Grandmaster Greytalker

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    Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:18 am  
    Re: exploration, clearing the wilds, kingdom building

    CombatMedic wrote:
    I'm thinking of running a semi-sandbox sort of game, with themes of exploration, monster and bandit clearing, and kingdom building. . . .

    So, if you were to run something like this in GH, where would you set it? On the Darlene Map? If so, which region? Off the map? Where?

    Just curious to see what you guys suggest.


    This describes my current campaign - the longest and most frequent I've run in years. It is set in the County of Ulek east of the Old Hills and west/south of the Lortmils, north of the Old River. On the Darlene map there is a hex surrounded by hills and mountains on 5 sides. That's it. The party controls that hex, is attempting to civilize it and expand to the surrounding hexes as vassals of the Count of Ulek. I have the area having been largely depopulated after the Hateful Wars and again after the Greyhawk Wars, becoming semi-wilderness. The Count was happy to have anyone show an interest in reclaiming the area.
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