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    Canonfire :: View topic - Paynims and Al'Akbar - anyone care to explain this?
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    Paynims and Al'Akbar - anyone care to explain this?
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    Journeyman Greytalker

    Joined: Jan 21, 2010
    Posts: 196


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    Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:55 am  
    Paynims and Al'Akbar - anyone care to explain this?

    Well, first of all... This thread is about alignments. So if you don't take them at all seriously, you won't be much of help :)

    I'm dreadfully confused about Paynims and the Mahdi of Plains. Mahdi is the representative of Al'Akbar, a LG deity. However paynims are almost exclusively CN or N, which makes them arguably one of the most chaotic nations in Greyhawk.

    I'm not a big fan of the idea that any LG deity and his messiah ruled over a through and through chaotic nation and everyone would be happy. Usually if a government and the people are distinctly different in morals and philosophy, conflicts do occur. However this "Mahdi unites Paynims and he's super-popular" tells a different story.

    So...
    Is Living Greyhawk Gazetteer openly spitting at the whole alignment-system or is there something more to this than meets the eye or it is just me?
    GreySage

    Joined: Aug 03, 2001
    Posts: 3310
    From: Michigan

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    Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:13 am  

    Presumably lawful characters are better at unifying people than chaotic characters are.

    The connection between Al'Akbar and the Paynims goes back to the 1st edition DMG.

    I think a chaotic people could accept a lawful ruler, but I don't think they'd all revere Al'Akbar in an orthodox way; probably most of them would concentrate more on ancestor worship, beast totems, and the like.

    The conflict you're describing would occur if the Mahdi had no patience in attempting to force the Paynims to adopt a strict lawful good alignment, or if the Paynims refused to accept a ruler who wouldn't ceremonially molest a goat, as was tradition. However, I don't think either scenario is likely. A lawful good character isn't obligated to do the impossible and convert an entire nation instantly; it's enough for him to lead by example and slowly win people over, even if it takes generations. Meanwhile, the fondness the Paynims feel toward the Mahdi is tied up with their sense of ethnic pride and solidarity, not alignment. As long as he appeals to their patriotism, they could care less what he does to goats.
    Master Greytalker

    Joined: Aug 17, 2004
    Posts: 924
    From: Computer Desk

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    Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:11 pm  

    It is important to remember that alignments are not straight jackets but behavior inclinations. Also, religions are rife with numerous theological interpretations which explains the various sects that seem to florish.

    The loss of the Cup and Talisman of Al'Akbar has already created a theological schism - Exalted and True Faiths. Even the 1ed hints that the paynim supports neither interpretation. I'm sure, in no small part to the neutral natures of its tribes. One doubts, given the individualistic nature these tribes can never be completely united.

    Sects of Al'Akbar:
    Mosque of Al'Akbar (Exalted Faith: LG (NG))
    Influence: Caliphate of Ekbir, Sultanate of Zeif and Southern Tusmit
    Oversight Order: Abd-Al-Din (Servant of the Faith)
    Member: The Faithful
    Heraldry: Eight-Pointed Star of Al'Akbar
    The Exalted Faith of Al'Akbar emphasizes decorum and dignity to encourage a righteous society. Its religious interpretation is dominant within Ekbir, Zeif and southern Tusmit. The Abd-Al-Din oversees the Elder Spahi (Paladins) and Qadi (Priests). Known for their diplomatic efforts to ease tensions within the basin. The faithful seek to spread the Exalted Faith amongst the Paynim of the Plains and within northern Tusmit. The religious ambition of the Abd-Al-Din is the recovery of the Cup and Talisman of Al'Akbar. The Abd-Al-Din believes the recovery of these sacred artifacts will encourage the spiritual reconciliation needed to form a universal caliphate.

    Mosque of Al'Akbar (True Faith: LN)
    Influence: Ket and Northern Tusmit
    Oversight Order: Abd-Al-Abbas (Servant of the Austere)
    Member: The Obedient
    Heraldry: Cup and Talisman of Al'Akbar
    The True Faith of Al'Akbar emphasizes the discipline and obedience to maintain a moral society. Its religious interpretation is dominant within Ket and northern Tusmit. The Abd-Al-Abbas oversees the Elder Somb (Paladins) and Mullahs (Priests). Known for its promotion of strict traditionalist values within society. The obedient seek to strengthen their position within southern Tusmit and Thornward. The religious ambition of the Abd-Al-Abbas is the recovery of the Cup and Talisman of Al'Akbar. The Abd-Al-Abbas believe the recovery of these sacred artifacts will provide the True Faith with the prestige required to supplant the Exalted Faith.

    Faith of Al'Akbar (Chosen Faith: LG (CG))
    Influence: Plains of the Paynims
    Oversight Order: Abd-Al-Mukhtar (Servant of the Chosen)
    Member: The Dutiful
    Heraldry: Broken Cup and Talisman of Al'Akbar
    The Abd-Al-Mukhtar considers itself the guardian of the unsullied tenets of Al’Akbar. The chosen faith believes in the eventual rise of the blessed Mahdi; the true son of Al’Akbar. The chosen faith emphasizes the moral duty to prepare for the blessed Mahdi. Its religious interpretation is dominant on the Plains of the Paynims. The Abd-Al-Mukhtar oversees the Dervishes (Paladins) and Imams (Priests). The dutiful believe both the Exalted Faith and True Faith are misguided corruptions of the original intents of Al’Akbar. Generally, the Abd-Al-Mukhtar supports the aspirations of any honourable mahdi candidates. As such, the latest mahdi candidate has managed to earn the loyalty of the Dervishes of Lake Udrukanar. Whereas, most paynim tribes remain skeptical of such dubious claims.
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