Signup
Welcome to... Canonfire! World of GreyhawK
Features
Postcards from the Flanaess
Adventures
in Greyhawk
Cities of
Oerth
Deadly
Denizens
Jason Zavoda Presents
The Gord Novels
Greyhawk Wiki
#greytalk
JOIN THE CHAT
ON DISCORD
    Canonfire :: View topic - Fly spell
    Canonfire Forum Index -> Greyhawk- AD&D 2nd Edition
    Fly spell
    Author Message
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2459
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:27 am  
    Fly spell

    Tossing out another Lanthorn question upon which for you all to chew:

    A mage casts Fly, which allows him/her to, basically, Levitate as well, with no thought required. The spell description notes that only minimal concentration is needed to alter direction and speed, implying that remaining stationary requires no thought (in my interpretation).

    The mage is rendered DEAD, stunned, or unconscious while aloft. NO Dispel Magic has been employed.

    Does he/she fall immediately?

    Or does he/she remain stationary until the duration expires?

    -Lanthorn

    p.s. this scenario has come up in game OFTEN for me, including yesterday!
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 28, 2010
    Posts: 95
    From: San Diego, CA

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:20 pm  

    Sorry for the duplicate posting...

    Last edited by illustr8or on Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Nov 28, 2010
    Posts: 95
    From: San Diego, CA

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:24 pm  

    Quote:
    Should the spell duration expire while the subject is still aloft, the magic fails slowly. The subject floats downward 60 feet per round for 1d6 rounds. If it reaches the ground in that amount of time, it lands safely. If not, it falls the rest of the distance, taking 1d6 points of damage per 10 feet of fall. Since dispelling a spell effectively ends it, the subject also descends in this way if the fly spell is dispelled, but not if it is negated by an antimagic field.


    My vote is for a slow(ish) descent with damage.
    GreySage

    Joined: Jul 26, 2010
    Posts: 2591
    From: LG Dyvers

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:34 pm  

    From a purely technical point of view, I would look to the fact that the spell has a specific duration that is not dependent upon the concentration of the caster. Therefore, the simplist interpretation is that the unconscious flyer simply hovers in the spot they went unconscious at.

    However, here are a few potential considerations which each DM may use as they wish to alter such effects.

    1) It seems reasonable to assume that flying under the effects of a fly spell is as simple as walking. What happens to a walker who falls unconscious or dies? they immediately fall to the ground.

    2) I don't know if it is a general rule for spells or if it is only specifically mentioned in some spell descriptions, but you may consider that any spell immediately ends when its caster falls unconscious or dies. In this case, the spell immediately ends and the flyer crashes to the ground. (cf 4) as well.) Of course, this would not apply to some spells with permanent durations. In general terms, I play assuming that spells and their effects end when the caster dies or falls unconscious, but there are many spells whose effects such a rule does not apply to.

    3) Perhaps the Fly spell remains in effect under such circumstances, but, lacking even minimal direction, causes the unconscious flyer to slowly fall to the ground as if under the effects of a Feather Fall. They may then hover a few inches above the ground/water/whatever other surface they would otherwise come into contact with.

    4) If 3) is opted for, perhaps a flyer traveling at great speed who suddenly becomes unconscious or dies continues to move, but their trajectory and speed slowly decrease until they finally come to a rest floating a few inches above the ground or crash into something hard. Evil Grin

    Hope these suggestions help.

    SirXaris

    Edit: Spelling.


    Last edited by SirXaris on Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2459
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:41 pm  

    YES, they do! I am always open to multiple interpretations and arguments, either way. Or, if someone can cite a specific rule from a source (particularly if it is 1 or 2e, given the location of this post...if not, that is OK, too!), I would appreciate that as well.

    Thanks, fellas. Anyone else?

    -Lanthorn
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 10, 2003
    Posts: 1234
    From: New Jersey

    Send private message
    Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:27 pm  

    I for one have always ruled that spells are tied to the mage that cast them. So when the mage dies his link to the magic ceases with him. Now spells which are permanent do not cease and a transformation to a Lich keeps the mage in contact with magic the same way his undead body walks the prime material plane.

    This is my rule as I never wanted the question as what happens when the mage who cast the spell dies. Now if your using hovering on deaths door, one may assume the link remains and the mage will hover until the spell ends, at which point the mage will plummet to his untimely death.

    Later

    Argon
    Black Hand of Oblivion

    Joined: Feb 16, 2003
    Posts: 3806
    From: So. Cal

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:47 am  

    Spells with durations last until they wear off, even if the Wizard is dead, unless the spell description (or the DM) says otherwise. As to fly, you might wish to have a Wizard who is in uncontrolled flight (for whatever reason) drift slightly in the air. Perhaps use the grenade-like missiles scatter chart direction for drift direction, plus a dice for ascend/descend. Total distance could be random as well (1d4 movement drift).

    I don't think I have ever seen this question come up before. Total DM adjudication here. Above is one idea, but make it do what you want it to.
    _________________
    - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2459
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 10:03 am  

    Ceb and Argon, thank you both. I have been really baffled by this situation because it has come up several times throughout the years:

    1) Had two mages Flying in a combat situation (like dogfighting) over the Woolly Bay until the PC wizard finally managed to slay his rival (I think the coup de grace ended with a well-placed and close-quarters Burning Hands spell, but this was YEARS ago...). I ruled that since the enemy was still moving (tried to strafe the PC with a touch-related attack) upon death, his momentum carried him along. This resulted in a KER-SPLAT! in the Bay. To add insult to injury (and death), I dimly recall that he wore a Ring of Water Walking, too, that I ruled would NOT permit his body to sink, so he hit the water HARD.

    2) When I was a player, my PCs slew a Flying mage over said Woolly Bay (my PCs were likewise battling the Slavers, too, in a similar, cross-over campaign). He just hung there in mid-air, like a gruesome, bloody pinata. In the end, I think my characters somehow retrieved his corpse by lassooing his body (or grapple, perhaps...again, been a while) and pulling him to the deck.

    3) Just recently, a PC wizard was grappled by shambling mound (see associated 'shambler' thread, if you like) and was being engulfed to his ultimate doom. Shocked Luckily for the sorceror, he had already enacted a Fly spell prior to the engagement. Obviously he was going to die, and as he was physically weak (as most mages tend to be), he cannot break free. The mage wisely uttered a Dimension Door spell as his legs disappeared into the plant monster's abdomen and he continued to get dragged inside it. POOF! He reappeared HUNDREDS of yards above the shambler, but now he was 'stunned' as per the spell's description. I had to rule, based on prior DM adjudication, that he was, basically, Levitating above the creature. Although the wizard escaped with his life, the shambler made off with the mage's dropped gear, including a Cloak of Displacement! Confused

    So, ya see, these situations do come up!

    Thank you all for your postings!!! More Lanthorn queries to come, count on it! Cool

    -Lanthorn
    Grandmaster Greytalker

    Joined: Jul 10, 2003
    Posts: 1234
    From: New Jersey

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:45 pm  

    So Lanthorn I believe your query should be why do mages cast fly spells over Woolly Bay? In your campaign it rarely ends well.

    Later

    Argon
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2459
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:48 pm  

    Laughing Good point! Happy

    -Luckless Lofty Lanthorn
    Apprentice Greytalker

    Joined: Oct 03, 2011
    Posts: 79
    From: Fairwind Isle

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:02 pm  

    And now for a little silliness...

    If a flying creature is killed/knocked unconscious it drops like a stone, except maybe an air elemental or a few others from the Elemental Plane of Air. Using this logic, the mage would drop as well. Or just rename the spell to "Advanced Levitate". Razz

    And now back to our regularly scheduled discussion thread...

    This is an interesting situation that I haven't had happen. I would rule that if they were killed/knocked unconscious it would depend on the cause. For example, if a ballista were the cause, the force would certainly take them somewhere, even to the ground. If they suffered a heart attack I would probably rule that they drift for the duration.
    GreySage

    Joined: Sep 09, 2009
    Posts: 2459
    From: SW WA state (Highvale)

    Send private message
    Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:19 pm  

    Elliva, silliness is welcome...at least by me.

    I think the reason why the flying creatures drop like the proverbial stone is b/c they are flying on their own power.

    With the Fly spell, magical energies are at work instead of muscle power. As Ceb noted, spells continue onward til their durations end, and thusly, I deduce that this would likewise hold true for a Fly cast on an aerial person, even if he/she is dead. Seems bizarre, perhaps even counterintuitive, but there ya have it! Happy

    Keep posting, if for no other reason than occasional comic relief!

    -Lanthorn
    Display posts from previous:   
       Canonfire Forum Index -> Greyhawk- AD&D 2nd Edition All times are GMT - 8 Hours
    Page 1 of 1

    Jump to:  

    You cannot post new topics in this forum
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum
    You cannot edit your posts in this forum
    You cannot delete your posts in this forum
    You cannot vote in polls in this forum




    Canonfire! is a production of the Thursday Group in assocation with GREYtalk and Canonfire! Enterprises

    Contact the Webmaster.  Long Live Spidasa!


    Greyhawk Gothic Font by Darlene Pekul is used under the Creative Commons License.

    PHP-Nuke Copyright © 2005 by Francisco Burzi. This is free software, and you may redistribute it under the GPL. PHP-Nuke comes with absolutely no warranty, for details, see the license.
    Page Generation: 0.28 Seconds