I "recently" finished a campaign in which my player and several NPCs ran afoul Old Mother Grubb's House of Fortune as depicted in The City of Greyhawk boxed set. This included a daytime covert infiltration of the aforementioned gaming house so as to avoid the night crew and the host of patrons (who beat the tar out of a PC when he resisted them...he was unceremoniously dumped outside, bloodied, semi-conscious, and stripped of all his possessions).
Long story short: the party defeated some nearby sentries (eyes and ears of Old Mother Grubb's who watch her place during the daytime hours) as well as Kaarain Mandair (priestess of Erythnul who 'runs' the place) after a pitched battle, then (finally) located the hidden staircase leading underground. Shortly thereafter, they successfully located the zombies, and, much to their horror, Grubb's vampire minions.
Luckily for them, Old Mother Grubb herself never showed (she'd have mopped the floor with them given her tremendous abilities as a 16th lvl mage AND a vampire), but, as From the Ashes mentions (I had this pretty much planned as an outcome should the characters succeed), the House of Fortune was put to the torch shortly thereafter (this was mainly led by some alerted clerics of Trithereon to the undead threat).
No source I read claims she, too, was killed specifically, and in my game, this surely did not happen. She is still 'at large.'
The question is..."Does anyone know information beyond what was given in the aforementioned sources regarding Old Mother Grubb?" I am thinking of having her as a potential recurring villain against those who destroyed her unholy brood, her lair (at least on the surface, for nowhere did it mention where her coffin was located!), and her lucrative operation.
"The Adventure Begins" only mentions that the church of Pelor erected an orphanage on the site where Grubb's House once stood (personally, I think this is insane, UNLESS they consecrated and rendered the area "holy").
I am open to suggestions, comments, and information you may have about this diabolical NPC. Individual opinions are welcome, as always. I've greatly appreciated what people have offered in the past to help augment my own ideas.
From what I read the gambling house was a brothel. Old Mother Grubb blackmailed several city officials and those that didn't pay mysteriously disappeared? Kaarain Mandair animated those killed at the brothel and sold the zombies to the Sewermen's and Streetsweeper's Union. The head of the union, Imre Petrosian. Did you use Imre, or that hook in your plot?
I used something different as my 'hook.' The paladin of Pelor who is mentioned as being slain by Old Mother Grubb was an NPC 'friend' of the party. When he went missing, they went searching, and since one of the PCs was present during the 'abduction' it was pretty simple for them to track down the location where he went missing.
The reason the PC's didn't encounter Old Mother Grubb was the fact she set the players up to destroy her business. Since she's high level out of reach of the players abilities she could be a reoccurring villain who manipulates adventurers to do her dirty work for her.
Kaarian Mandair could have had some information, or magical item that O.M.G. wanted but could not acquire without making enemies with other evil allies. This would be of course worth more than the business she operated.
If you go with this route, then if Kaarian was killed make it known that the former priestess was buried and within a week the body was stolen. OMG would use speak with dead to pry the info/item out, and as a bonus animate her for a future villain for the group.
I know that Old Mother Grubb has many 'low life' scum under her thumb, and I intend to have some of them as preliminary villains. Among them I intend to add thieves, thugs, mercenaries, and Rhennee, as well. Should this fail, maybe OMG has other operatives (maybe other vampire spawn not found in the cellars of her House of Fortune) who will prove more effective in exacting her vengeance. Of course, given her extremely powerful sorcery, she could use a whole host of nasty spells from afar to harass the PCs...
I must admit there appears to be no other reference to her.
In my next campaign the players should come across her old place and hopefully take it down. I admit that I have cheated a little by doing 2 versions of mother grub.
A vampire is potent enough so I have made her an adept if the party appear too weak, however if they are fairly powerful then she is the full story!
All that said, I have placed her coffin in the Lords Tomb(H9) in the high quarter of the City. The guards and wizard can be charmed or simply don't know she is there.
The city is a big place and there are options, go with what you think makes an interesting back drop, a villain that just keeps coming back
All that said, I have placed her coffin in the Lords Tomb(H9) in the high quarter of the City. The guards and wizard can be charmed or simply don't know she is there.
Great place! I think there's even a reference that the Lords' Tomb complex is haunted, or that undead stalk the deeper reaches. What a wonderful and safe refuge for OMG's coffin.
There should be more scattered throughout the City, though. If you have any other ideas, I'd love to hear them. Some might be in obscure sites, of course, not to mention areas outside the City of Greyhawk in foreign cities, the wilderness, and the like. Perhaps even another Plane of existence, too, given that OMG may have the power to teleport to other dimensions.
Yes, Sarana, High Matriarch of Pelor (Priest 14) would have sanctified the grounds before building the orphanage there. Given what they learned of OMG, Jerome Kazinskaia, Patriarch of Rao (Priest 17) probably helped.
Once the true identity of OMG was established, she would have gained many powerful enemies within Greyhawk.
Vampire Spawn are created from Characters of 5th level and lower. OMG could have more powerful minions available, true vampires.
Once "turned," a vampire is subject to the vampire that "turned" it, until that vampire is destroyed. OMG could easily have two, or three, 6th and 7th level "fighter" vampires, or fallen Paladin vampires, etc.
Glad to continue keeping it weird (just like the city of Portland!).
In researching my "City of Greyhawk" boxed set, I rediscovered the network of tunnels and crypts on one of the maps. A Lo! and Behold! there is a series of such in the Old City NEXT to Old Mother Grubb's House of Fortune where the 'commoners' get buried...
Thinking this could be her 'main haunt' given its close proximity to her House of Fortune, with a back-up (one of many, no doubt) lair in the Lords' Tomb up in the High Quarter.
Already I am getting nefarious ideas for a future campaign, but, as always, I like to entertain ideas from you all, too...
Don't want to add a new thread for a quick question, but it pertains to the vampire's Charming ability. I want to make sure I am correct about this, b/c my plot continues with OMG.
A vampire's Charm Person ability can be used more than once on any victim until successful, right (though I may rule that a natural "20" would make the subject immune for that given 'scene')???
If successful, would a victim recognize that something might be 'afoot'? A slight headache, dizziness, or tingling sensation? I think the PHB mentions a successful saving throw vs. a magical effect could (DM's option) reveal such information.
OMG intends to track down those responsible for destroying her coven of undead spawn, and this ability makes such information gathering VERY useful...
Don't want to add a new thread for a quick question, but it pertains to the vampire's Charming ability. I want to make sure I am correct about this, b/c my plot continues with OMG.
A vampire's Charm Person ability can be used more than once on any victim until successful, right (though I may rule that a natural "20" would make the subject immune for that given 'scene')???
If successful, would a victim recognize that something might be 'afoot'? A slight headache, dizziness, or tingling sensation? I think the PHB mentions a successful saving throw vs. a magical effect could (DM's option) reveal such information.
OMG intends to track down those responsible for destroying her coven of undead spawn, and this ability makes such information gathering VERY useful...
-Lanthorn
In 1E, at least, I would rule that a successful save negates the charm ability for that encounter. The vampire can't just try again next round. If they crossed paths again a couple of days later, then sure, the vampire gets another chance.
From my understanding of innate powers and spell-like abilities, they can be used as many times as possible (unless noted otherwise), even against the same target.
Perhaps this is just fluff, but I seem to remember that a vampire's charm ability lies in its ability to mesmerize a victim with its eyes. Basically, you must meet the vampire's eyes for it to have a chance to charm you. So, if you suddenly shake yourself out of almost falling into a mesmerizing trance while looking at (and probably being spoken to by) a vampire, you are very likely to recognize the effect of magic upon your mind. That is, unless you're a zero-level newb with absolutely no experience in the outside world.
SX, you are correct that the victim must meet the gaze of the vampire, but averting such an attack is not always easily done. In combat, if one averts their eyes, an attack penalty is warranted. Furthermore, one does not always know they are being mesmerized. Finally, if you are, say, bound by said vampire (especially with their great strength), it is not always easy to glance away (but clamping one's eyes is a sure fire way to avoid it).
Anyhow, it is my understanding the vampire can employ this sinister power as many times as inhumanly possible...
Yes, technically, I believe they can use it any number of times, but it would be quite reasonable, in my humble opinion, for you, as the DM, to limit that power to a more reasonable number of uses. If you have any inclination to take later editions as an example, in 3.5e and Pathfinder, such abilities are almost always worded in such a way as to say that once an individual has successfully saved vs. that particular ability from that particular monster, s/he cannot be affected by it again for the next 24 hours.
Thus, if the vampire successfully charms the victim, but the charm is broken by a friendly wizard casting dispel magic, the vampire may attempt to charm the victim again. But, once that victim has made a save against the charm attempt, he is automatically immune to it for the next 24 hours. Other victims may be charmed by the same vampire each and every round, however.
Regarding my previous post:
What I was saying above is that when the target of a spell successfully makes their saving throw against a spell or ability that assaults their mind, it is reasonable to grant that the PC would know that such an assault had taken place and would be on guard against it for reasonable period of time thereafter. After all, the saving throw in cases like these represents the PC's will power being strong enough to throw off the caressing tendrils of magic that are trying to subvert that PC's will.
Imagine a very charismatic speaker who has a crowd worked up and agreeing with everything he says. Then, one person in the crowd realizes what's happening - that the speaker is using psychological manipulation to tell the crowd what it wants to hear, then twisting it to focus their anger at an inappropriate target. There is no magic involved, but that one person suddenly has an epiphany, realizing that he was about to fall for the trick. (I am imagining that picture of the crowd all saluting Hitler while one man in the center stands with his arms folded across his chest and the caption reads, "Be that guy.") A magical assault upon one's mental acuities should result in such a realization if the assault is broken and fails.
SX, thanks for your take, and I do (occasionally) borrow from other editions even though you know I am a die-hard 2e fan with 1e overtones.
Please note that the vampiric charm is slightly different (more potent) than the wizard's or cleric's version (at least it is in older editions) and does not require verbal communication for the undead 'master' to employ once mental domination is established.
More to come on the OMG topic later, including more questions I intend to field towards the greater collective.
The Greyhawk City boxed set mentions that OMG and her priestess of Erythnul often sell items to the Guild of Wizardry but are careful to avoid 'hocking' items that might bring attention. This implies they deal with Bubka, and I doubt he asks too many questions so long as he makes a good deal on the exchange.
Wondering if you all think that OMG handles this herself, or if the priestess is the liaison?
Secondly, is OMG herself a member of the Guild? Perhaps she has an alternative identity she uses (This might be the opener for a separate thread about the internal workings of the Guild itself and its membership policies, etc.). I'd think, given her level, power base, and vampiric abilities, it only makes sense she'd have infiltrated the Wizard's Guild, too, albeit with far more care and subtlety.
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