I have a problem with Tuerny's magical abilities in "Return of the Eight":
Here is his description at the end of the adventure:
Nalfeshnee
Special defenses and vulnerability
Spells: 17th level wizard (only verbal and somatic components)
Various spell-like powers (no components) including self-polymorph (into human form only, as Tuerny appears in life).
The combination of these two types of spells is problematic for me and, in my opinion, makes him too powerful.
At the end of adventure Q1, Lolth's powers are described:
Goddess powers
Special defenses
As a giant spider: some powers like shape change, gate, teleport with no error.
In humanoid form: 16th cleric/14th magic-user.
Shouldn't we do it like with Lolth: his Nalfeshnee powers or his 17th-level magic-user powers when he is in human form?
After all, he was transformed into a Dretch by Graz'zt. Was he a Dretch with the spells of a 17th-magic-user ?
More generally, does a human transformed into a minor demon (Dretch) retain all his magical powers? What do you think?
When I was recently revisiting the lists of changes in levels to the various gods, that included a review of the quasi-deities, which Tuerny was listed as by Gary in Dragon #71.
So, making him a powerful figure akin to Murlynd, Heward, or Keoghtom is the original intent, although I’ve not done an a/b comparison between Tuerny’s Rot8 stats and those figures’ abilities yet.
Allan. _________________ Allan Grohe<br />https://www.greyhawkonline.com/grodog/greyhawk.html<br />https://grodog.blogspot.com/
My personal campaign theory is not fully developed because I've never needed it to be, but in a nutshell, this is how I consider class levels for immortal beings.
A being's mortal life is when it 'learns' the best. That is the time that it makes decisions that will 'set' its beliefs for eternity (for the most part).
If a human can attain 20th level in 90 years of life as a mortal, it may retain some of those (at their god's discretion? Factors?) when they pass to the immortal realm. Whether they begin their immortal existence at the bottom rung of eternal beings or are started with a boost is up to their god. Most, obviously, begin at the bottom.
Though a being's opportunity to 'learn' is much greater during their mortal existence, they can still 'learn' and change their thinking during their eternal immortal existence, but it takes MUCH longer. For example, a human may attain 2nd level in a class with 2,000 experience points. An immortal being, however, would require 200 billion experience points (or some incredible number like that) to gain 2nd level in a class. Of course, at the discretion of the gods, perhaps there may be exceptions to this rule. Certainly, most beings that die aren't able to keep their class levels. This may be due to the power a god must expend to grant a soul eternal status. The more powerful the being a god creates with that soul (a deva vs. a solar), the more resources it costs that god. It may require an inordinate amount of resource expenditure for a god to create such an eternal body while keeping the class level experience the soul has gained. Thus, most newly eternal souls are simply manes, dretches, eladrins, etc. with no special class levels, even if they had some in their mortal life.
I came up with that basic theory simply as a way of explaining why all eternal beings, from dretch to the gods, aren't all level 2,000+ in various classes.
Obviously, the theory needs much work, but I haven't needed to go into more detail yet. But,
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But,