I'm interested in knowing who all uses random encounter tables. Do you? Do you make your own? Use one's provided from a previous edition? How do you go about determining a specific encounter?
If you use random encounter tables for Greyhawk and make your own, how much effort to you put into it? How many rolls are you willing to make to determine all the information you need for a 3.5 encounter? Is there any information the current rules do not provide that you would like to see included? Example, Lair%.
Anything else you want to add about random encounters? _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
I use random encounter tables for journeys across the lands of the Flanaess. The best bit about random encounter tables is how it keeps you as a DM on your toes. Because you don't know what's coming next it really stretches your ability to improvise and fly by the seat of your pants. I love that. It puts you back on par with the players.
We have a long standing agreement IMC; if you travel in the wilds, all CR's and EL's are off the menu. You meet what you meet. Only once in 25+ years of gaming have I totally fudged an encounter; when a low level group had the misfortune to encounter a Behir. A reroll was definately called for. Heck, even I went pale at that one. On a couple of occasions a random encounter in the wilds has wiped out a party, but that has just served to reinforce the anything can happen philosophy.
I tend to use the encounter cards/tables from FTA as a basic roll and then use other tables when the "standard encounter" result appears. It's quite strange that you should post this thread now, Eileen, because I recently ordered a product called The Mother Of All Encounter Tables from Amazon; if anyone has this I wouldn't mind hearing what you think. Unfortunately Amazon keep stalling me with out of stock e-mails so I'm going to have to get it elsewhere.
I use the 1st edition rules for determining the chances of an encounter occuring; the current "by the hour" system is too unwieldy. I did use the % in lair roll when writing encounters up in advance, but if I'm working on the fly nothing the party meets is in it's lair. No treasure, Yay! Plenty of risk of death, Yay! Me happy DM.
I use them, especially for long overland journeys. I generally make my own, using the rules set down in the 1e Monster Manual II. I try to keep the encounters somewhat appropriate for the characters, but I don't worry about it too much. It's not unusual for my players to encounter something far too tough for them to handle, but those encounters have proven to be some of the most memorable elements of my campaigns. Often the players will take note of particularly tough monsters and will return in their "downtime" to find their lairs. Several impromptu but very enjoyable adventures have occurred this way.
That said, I much prefer to determine "random" encounters ahead of time, making sure I provide meaningful encounters for the party instead of simple "there's a monster, go kill it" encounters. Unfortunately, I rarely have sufficient prep time to use the preferred method.
Hello Eileen, I usually draw up a "random" encounter table conversant to the evenings game (I really don't like the application of random).
Say the PC group are in mountains during the winter season, pursuing a group of ogres, then I may draw up a table or tables to be reflective to night or day or both and keep it short and sweet.
1. Dead ogre being chewed on by... 3d4 winter wolves...
2. No encounter.
3. Hill giant.
4. No encounter.
5. Lost/discarded item found by PCs. Disregard if rolled more than twice.
6. Mountain lion(s)... 1d4 (or at night use giant bats/stirges)
This way the encounters match the scenario and/or can add to the actual game at hand. I find Total Random tables sometimes can detract from a game.
Hmmm......sounds like we are quite similiar in our approaches Ragr (no surprise there). I prefer random encounters as opposed to predetermined ones. When I do use a predetermined encounter it is strictly to advance a plotline about what is going on. Example, the characters had returned from White Plume Mountain with Blackrazor and were travelling from Greyhawk City to Nyrond with it. An cleric of Hextor had orders to steal it and utilize a green dragon in an attempt to do so. Thus, along the way I had the encounter planned in advance. These events are rare but when they do happen they are usually something we remember over the years as I try and make them more than worthy.
Ragr said:
Quote:
The best bit about random encounter tables is how it keeps you as a DM on your toes. Because you don't know what's coming next it really stretches your ability to improvise and fly by the seat of your pants. I love that. It puts you back on par with the players.
I agree completely. This is one of the better aspects of DMing. I don't always want to know what is going to happen and thus enjoy the surprise that random encounters bring.
Ragr said:
Quote:
We have a long standing agreement IMC; if you travel in the wilds, all CR's and EL's are off the menu. You meet what you meet.
I do the same thing. What is rolled on the table is what you get. I don't follow the rules per say in the DMG on exactly how encounter tables are built, I eyeball encounter levels. Some wilderness areas are specifically designed to be "easier" or "harder" than other areas so that information is reinforced on the tables. I make travelling across the plains fairly easy in order for merchants to get through.
Ragr said:
Quote:
I tend to use the encounter cards/tables from FTA as a basic roll and then use other tables when the "standard encounter" result appears.
This is where I start when I make my own tables. I read the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer entries for an area as well as the surrounding terrains in detail, pulling out any mention of specific monsters. I then consult the cards from FTA to make sure everything (or almost everything) is included in my tables. I divide up people encounters, monsters, animals, and vermin as well rather than have one chart. I go into a lot more detail when constructing tables and what information is provided in the final outcome. It would take up to much time to describe the process here.
OK, confession time: The real reason I am asking is because this is one area I have spent a lot of time in and I feel reasonably good about my DMing ability. I have considered posting random encounter tables since last summer. I haven't done so because I felt that my tables would be more detail than what people would want in their campaign. This is why I am asking questions. I don't want to dumb down the tables for posting. I don't want to post them if people are very specific about what they do or don't like. I don't want to post them if people are not going to use them. The bottom line is that I would want the encounter tables to be worthwhile to folks and that they would be of use in many campaigns.
My system includes extensive use of the MM and mild use of the other books. A typical encounter table will have about 20 monsters on it from the MM and about 5 from each of the other books. I like making encounter tables and recognize that some view it as a lot of work....I was disapointed that 3.0 and 3.5 had nothing that I would consider worthwhile for encounter tables. I know they added some in the environment books but the layout was totally different than mine so I chose to ignore them.
Another question which I wish I had put in my original post:
How do you (everyone) use monsters from the other Monster Manuals and Fiend Folio for Greyhawk. Do you add them, not use them, what do you do?
The other question I really would like answered is:
How many die rolls are you willing to make to determine a random encounter? _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
I do draft and use random encounter tables, but usually pre-roll everything inbetween game nights. It cuts down on the dice-rolling by me in-game; my players get bored very quickly when I have to make a dozen rolls and consult a couple of tables, then go through the MMs... So I have it all ready... _________________ Greyhawk is dead; long live Greyahwk! It is not heresy; I will not recant!
So far it sounds like the majority prefer to develop the encounters before hand. Would you use extensive tables in advance in order to cut down the downtime during a game? Again, a few die rolls but done the night before. I do take this approach when I know for certain where the PCs are headed and if it is a very long journey and if I'm sufficiently prepared.
I don't worry about encounters being to tough because I take an approach similar to what BusterBudd said here:
Dead ogre being chewed on by... 3d4 winter wolves...
The same can be said for dragon encounters (find eggs for example), bandits having just held up merchants, etc.
If something proves to be to much, then it usually ends up being a dangerous but fun encounter. _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
OK, confession time: The real reason I am asking is because this is one area I have spent a lot of time in and I feel reasonably good about my DMing ability. I have considered posting random encounter tables since last summer. I haven't done so because I felt that my tables would be more detail than what people would want in their campaign. This is why I am asking questions. I don't want to dumb down the tables for posting. I don't want to post them if people are very specific about what they do or don't like. I don't want to post them if people are not going to use them. The bottom line is that I would want the encounter tables to be worthwhile to folks and that they would be of use in many campaigns.
My system includes extensive use of the MM and mild use of the other books. A typical encounter table will have about 20 monsters on it from the MM and about 5 from each of the other books. I like making encounter tables and recognize that some view it as a lot of work....I was disapointed that 3.0 and 3.5 had nothing that I would consider worthwhile for encounter tables. I know they added some in the environment books but the layout was totally different than mine so I chose to ignore them.
Another question which I wish I had put in my original post:
How do you (everyone) use monsters from the other Monster Manuals and Fiend Folio for Greyhawk. Do you add them, not use them, what do you do?
Random tables are still on my to do list for my gazeteers. I was going to refer back to the 1e tables as my starting point (particularly as they included additional information about local patrols) and work forward to the more recent rule books to insert any 3e monsters that might be appropriate, checking frequency in each version to try and get an overall percentage. Since 4e is going to re-cast many monsters, I'm in no hurry to do all the work but I'd love somebody else to have a pop!
Random tables are still on my to do list for my gazeteers. I was going to refer back to the 1e tables as my starting point (particularly as they included additional information about local patrols) and work forward to the more recent rule books to insert any 3e monsters that might be appropriate, checking frequency in each version to try and get an overall percentage. Since 4e is going to re-cast many monsters, I'm in no hurry to do all the work but I'd love somebody else to have a pop!
This brings up another issue if it would be worthwhile....4th edition. Clearly all of the monsters currently in the MM wouldn't make the cut to 4th edition (at least until later on). If I did this and you went to 4th edition how would you handle entries on the charts which no longer are in the game? _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
I use the random encounter tables that are provided in the WoG Boxed Set for wilderness and outdoor encounters. They're still the best for Greyhawk adventuring IMO.
I use random encounter tables often. If it’s a journey then I use the tables from the 83 box set. If the party is staying in an area where some prolonged campaign action will occur, I will make one based on the adventure and the listed table for the area.
When I DMed the ToEE my encounter tables were heavy on ToEE patrols. I was using the recruitment rules, and it was one way of dealing with the massive amount of troops the Temple was building up.
Eileen; go ahead and submit your tables, I for one would be extremely interested to see them. I have no intention of fully converting my game to 4e and those that do can easily convert them or use bits and pieces of what you produce. And I'm not just saying that to save myself 18 quid.
Btw; has anybody seen or purchased The Mother Of All Encounter Tables? It's by the same folks who produced Tome Of Horrors (Necromancer Games I think, although correct me if I'm wrong).
I've almost never used random encounter tables, mainly because they seem to bog down play IMO, though I do have other reasons.
What I do is kind of a combo of what Busterbudd and Gargoyle do. I write them into the adventure as unrelated encounters to the main theme or goal that the party is working on. They're usually just related to whatever the party can handle that strikes my fancy at the time. I do take care to make sure that there is almost no chance of them killing anybody (Unless somebody does something really stupid). That may sound like fudging to some people but I think of adventures as a movie the players are in, and nobody likes to see the hero get iced by some random dude in the middle of a movie. It's anticlimactic and no fun for anyone.
Ok, if I give it a try, do tables keep their format (columns remain lined up) without getting spread out all over the place? Also when I clicked on the Submit Article link, it asked for URL? And what is HTMC? I know these are common terms but well, I have no idea what they are? If I have questions to ask Canonfire staff where do I go to contact them? _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
Ok, if I give it a try, do tables keep their format (columns remain lined up) without getting spread out all over the place? Also when I clicked on the Submit Article link, it asked for URL? And what is HTMC? I know these are common terms but well, I have no idea what they are? If I have questions to ask Canonfire staff where do I go to contact them?
It used to be quite a pain making tables in articles - basically you had to ask the editor to set it up for you. However, my last article uses tables and it was quite easy. I just created the table as part of the text in Word 2007 and copy-pasted my article into the box for submissions and everything worked out. I don't know if that comes from the new version of Word or something that has been done to the canonfire interface, but it was extremely simple. _________________ My campaigns are multilayered tapestries upon which I texture themes and subject matter which, quite frankly, would simply be too strong for your hobbyist gamer. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mp7Ikko8SI
I for one would love to see some random encounter tables.
On a related note, I'd like to see some sort of information regarding which monsters are native to what areas, how commonly they can be found there, etc. I think guides to the flora and fauna - the more exhaustive the better - for Greyhawk's major regions would be really great to have.
I use the ones in the Gazeteer as guidelines for fleshing out what sorts of creatures are present in a particular swamp, mountain, or other region. I don't actually roll on them to determine what the players face. The closest I come to that is picking something that intrigues me off the list to create an encounter from and then randomly determining when it happens.
I prefer the randomness of the encounter tables because it often results in an encounter with the ‘less than intriguing’ creatures that I might not usually consider, but end up being very entertaining encounters. Of course you have a good chance of running into a parade of merchants and patrols.
I use the ones in the Gazeteer as guidelines for fleshing out what sorts of creatures are present in a particular swamp, mountain, or other region. I don't actually roll on them to determine what the players face. The closest I come to that is picking something that intrigues me off the list to create an encounter from and then randomly determining when it happens.
I roll randomly in advance and add a few tidbits to link into the plot where possible. Once I have a few prepared encounters for each terrain I will roll randomly during the game to determine whether the first on the list occurs and so forth. I also determine the weather in advance in case that adds to the fun!
Ok, for those who said they were interested in random encounter tables, I will try and make some available to you. I will begin with the Yeomanry. After that, it depends upon usage by folks, interest in more etc. Each location's encounter tables and explanations provide a lengthy number of pages, as I include a lot more than monsters. My encounter tables include people (broken down into basic groupings), monsters (broken down by book (we don't all have the same books), animals, and vermin. The "people's" section includes basic stats for soldiers, bandits, specific notes for races corresponding, alignment preferences, specific notes for that area of the world, etc. Thus, each encounter table consists of several pages, and as mentioned I would begin with Yeomanry.
In my campaign, the core races and classes are pretty much arranged so that they appear in most places of the Flanaess. Races and classes from all other sources and prestige classes of every D&D book are regionalized, many of which do not appear as they don't fit my idea of Greyhawk well enough. I do not place a lot of these in each area of the world. They are considered "rarer". On another thread somewhere in Canonfire a couple of you may recall a discussion about multi-classing and the fact that it isn't real popular in my world based on player use. I also felt that the rules allow to much "bouncing around". Thus the tables include a smaller collection of non-core race, class, and prestige class variations. I like to regionalize these issues throughout my world in order to manage the amount of information better and give each area more of a distinct feel.
Here is the dilemma.....If I arrange the charts in the manner that works for my world, will it be to limiting for you? Certainly you will accept races, classes, and prestige classes that I would not allow. I want to make the article as useful as possible without changing everything (so to speak). I see the following options...
1. I can present it as it would be in my world. This restricts your creativity of the non-core races and classes, and all prestige classes, conforming to my idea. This is good if you don't really have your own ideas developed and your looking for a way to cut back on having so many options for each area. It limits new material giving it (hopefully) more of an old school feel. By downloading the article, you can take this section of the chart and change it on your own liking with your computer. You can delete the entries you don't like, you can add ones that you would like. Non-core races and classes and all prestige classes appear on subtables, making this pretty easy.
2. I can leave non-core races and classes out as well as prestige classes in order to allow you to better decide how to handle this issue and insert the information as you would like it. This gives you the most flexibility for your world but at the same time requires more effort than accepting someone elses work. Essentially, with these areas, you fill in the blanks.
3. I could make a "Master" chart which includes all of the books I have and you could do a free for all. This would slow down the article process but that isn't a real big deal to me.
4. You could offer solutions as to how you would like me to do this in order to make the article(s)? more useful to you. If you have another suggestion I would LOVE to hear it. I want to make the tables friendly for all who are looking for something of this nature. _________________ Eileen of Greyhawk, Prophet of Istus, Messenger of the Gods
I think you should just put them in a format appropriate for your own world. Since I'm addicted to tinkering (and I suspect quite a few others on these forums are as well), I'm probably going to change them up no matter what you do.
Not that this seems to be an actual poll anymore, but I had always used wandering encounter charts; in my last campaign with just two charts for overland travel through all of South Province. I'm trying a different approach for my Blackmoor campaign, keying specific random encounters to certain areas, with a x in 6 chance of encountering the given encounter in that area.
~Scott "-enkainen" Casper
There is an x in 6 chance of a Yak-Men-related tag line here...
I've used encounter tables that fit my homebrew. It helped to give an idea about the area when you saw some creatures in a particular area. I've run Greyhawk a couple of times for my wife and daughter and used some random encounters for that same reason, to give them a feel for the part of the world they were in.
One of the first campaigns I played in, circa '79, the GM used his Traveller campaign as the ancient history of his D&D campaign. This meant there was plenty of old technology as 'magic'. Also, he used the Gamma World mutation charts for roll-up (rare chance for effect) and his Special Encounters.
Once you left the farm area around towns and cities the encounter level was like 3rd level dungeon encounter chart. The DM also ran whatever rolled up on the charts. The plant with Attraction odor, vines and razor sharp leaves was really nasty. Our typical party was at least each player having two characters if they were new. The one time we decided to roll up three characters each with 8 players turned out great. We had one character in the front, middle and rear of the party. He rolled up a dragon. It belly flopped onto the middle. The rear crowd ran back to town, the front crew ran to the dungeon for 'safety'; the dragon had brunch. The party bought spears the next time and marched out with them held straight up. :)
I'd be interested in the fill in the blanks one, although the one based on your version of the world would be interesting. I've stopped buying books so I am more on the core classes etc. In the one campaign I started the party was from the Shield Lands on a diplomatic mission across the world to gather allies. The NPC was the diplomat, the party were his minions and would seek to do good deeds to get on the good side of those he was speaking with.
I was always a big fan of travel and encouter tables; otherwise you get the short hand - travel to nearby city will take 5 days - lets go - Ok five days later you arrive, what do you do next?
I like a mix of planned and random - I mean running into back to back dragons is too much - DM should use some discretion.
IMHO there is nothing particularly wrong with encountering stronger adversaries now and then; it shows the PCs that they are not the most powerful thing around and teaches caution. If they insist on blindly attacking everything in sight, some would say they deserve to be killed for their stupidity.
I often create dungeon/region/city/whatever-specific encounter tables for my adventures. I've been working through some ideas for Castle Greyhawk random encounter table templates at http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=4082 if anyone would care to chime in or comment here =) _________________ Allan Grohe<br />https://www.greyhawkonline.com/grodog/greyhawk.html<br />https://grodog.blogspot.com/
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I find Total Random tables sometimes can detract from a game.
aka BusterBudd
