Outside of a reference to the Sapphire Brotherhood in the Fate of Istus, I'm not aware of any monk organizations outside of the Scarlet Brotherhood.
Let's first consider religiously oriented monks; I don't think just saying that every lawful deity has an order of monks seems reasonable. With Xan Yae and Zuoken, I feel that there has to be a few in the Baklunish lands. There are probably some groups associated with Hextor and Heironeous, as well. Rao and St. Cuthbert also feel like a good fit from diametrically different aspects (serene versus zeal).
Nation-wise, I feel that the Horned Society would be the best fit outside of the Scarlet Brotherhood. Throw in the diabolic connection, and I think it's very easy to give them a suitably dramatic and sinister name.
In my campaign, the Four Bastards of Asmodeus terrorized the western coast of the Nyr Dyv before Reiner of Rao, the Company of Nine's monk, defeated them on the rooftops of Dyvers. Whether they left any behind to carry on their ways is a secret I'm holding close to my vest.
I remember Mike and Anna discussing this topic on one of their Legends and Lore episodes. I'm afraid I'm not much help beyond that as I don't remember which one it was and I don't know of any myself. However, I come from a 1st/2nd edition background and they didn't do as much with monks back then. At least not in the Flanaess that I'm aware of (I think that was more of an Oriental Adventures thing). Looking at Anna's maps, I see a lot of monasteries so maybe they did more with them during 3E+ and Living Greyhawk.
That ramble probably didn't help you at all. Sorry.
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Dragon #299 details an order of monks dedicated to Nerull, drawn from the novel Oath of Nerull by T.H. Lain.
"Dungeon of the Fire Opal" in Dungeon #84 details a ruined monastery based on the sample dungeon from the 1st edition DMG. The monks there once worshiped Wee Jas, though they hid their faith from their devil allies.
The Twilight Monastery in the Cairn Hills is dedicated to Xan Yae. It's detailed in Age of Worms Overload.
Erik Mona's "Baklunish Delights" in Oerth Journal #3 details three monasteries dedicated to Zuoken. The Falla-nil monastery is in the Ulsprues. The Azor-khem monastery is 60 miles to the south. The Flannae-tel Monastery is in the Cairn Hills, and the pregenerated PC from Ghost Tower of Inverness is its leader. The followers of Zuoken built a monastery in the Cairn Hills because their god is imprisoned nearby in Castle Greyhawk.
In general, I'd keep in mind that the "Shaolin" style of monk-as-martial artist isn't a divine spellcaster and doesn't need to be part of a clerical order or associated with any deity. The World of Greyhawk has two monk deities (Xan Yae and Zuoken), so that line can blur, but there's no reason a monastery couldn't be completely secular.
I've always liked the idea of keeping monks a class unique to the Scarlet Brotherhood. It just added that much more of an aura of mystery and menace to them...
The Savage Tide AP, from Dungeon Magazine, featured a cannabalistic order of monks who had a monastery in Scuttlecove. That is about all I can remember about them off the top of my head.
I have not really done much with monks until recently, and it was more of a 'let's see and find out' kind of attitude.
With that in mind, I used the Scarlet Brotherhood monk class as the template and didn't alter it at all. There is nothing inherently 'evil' with their abilities so I kept them as is.
That being said, I would permit most Lawfully-inclined or structured faiths to have monks. In Bastion of the Faith it mentions that monks are possible in their ranks. Hextor, too. I don't see any reason why Nerull couldn't, either. I would extend this to add Pholtus, Rao, and St Cuthbert as well. Pelor might have a small monastic order, too. Without going through the entire list of deities, I would think only some Powers would have monks.
Everyone seems to have slightly different opinions on Monk Orders in Greyhawk. There is a great article on here somewhere called 'Martial Monastic Orders of Greyhawk, or something like that. It is well worth a read.
I'm about two-thirds done on my own Monks article for greyhawk. I used the article above and 'Baklunish Delights' as an informed starting point.
There is very little official canon outside the Scarlet Brotherhood, though strong implications of religious orders in the Baklunish West practicing both martial monastic traditions and psionics.
I guess it depends on the flavour of Monks you want in Greyhawk. My article proposes that monks in the Flanaess are rare outside of the Scarlet Brotherhood and the Baklunish West. It describes three main Baklunish orders, two related to Xan Yae and one to Zuoken. The article describes the transition of martial monastic methods (say that three times quickly) into other lands to the East of the Baklunish states, resulting in mostly single school monasteries popping up in random locations.
The Oeridians take to martial monastic practices quite well and over decades it spreads. It never becomes common because it is so demanding and so esoteric, but none the less schools appear around different lands as far as Aerdy states to the West.
I don't have any demi-human based orders, because that is to my taste and matches the 1st edition restrictions. My article describe how Oeridian schools allowed anyone who could pass the entry tests into their order, very rarely excluding anyone because of race alone. So that meant players had options if they really wanted to, while keeping it rare.
Aside from the Scarlet Brotherhood and the three Baklunish Orders I describe a sample of other orders. None of them are large overall, but I indicate their are likely to be many small independent orders. While it would be easy to have orders tied to religions it flies against the overall tone of rareness that I was going for. So I think I had one originally Flan order (of the Helping Hand) that worshiped Zodal. While other deities seemed to also provide a potential good fit, I think I went with Fharlangn to produce an order of travelling monks seeking enlightment.
How about I just get around to finishing the article and post it?
In C1 - Hidden Shrine of the Tamoachan, there are two Olman monks.
22. CHAMBER OF THE NACEHUEL (Na-sG’-wal: “the achieved ones”)
All the doors into this lozenge shaped room are made of heavy bronze. There are entrances on the north, south and east walls. In the middle of this long apartment are two stone divans, each with a human figure stretched out upon it. Between the divans is a low stone table holding a flask and two goblets made of crystal. There are two sideboards against the walls. The figures on the couches are a male and female, each about middleaged and perfectly preserved. They are very still, dust covered, and apparently dead. Their bodies are covered with dry, crackling snakeskin. The female wears a silvery bracelet and holds what looks to be an ivory wand. The male has an amulet of bronze resting on his chest, inset with a red stone of considerable size. In the bottom of the crystal flask is a quantity of silvery dust. On the western wall are scribed colorful glyphs, barely translatable from Olman as, “Beware . . . many-eyed ‘god’ (?) will bring/rain a fiery end/death”.
Mixing the powder in the flask with a liquid will create a potion of dreadful sleep. If the potion is drunk the taster will sleep for 5,000 years, or until the potion’s effects are neutralized (i.e., neutralize poison). The two bodies are‘monks in suspended animation. The male, Cipactonal (S&pak‘-tG’kal) (AC 5; Level 7; HP LO; #AT 3/2; D: 3-9 open hand) and the female, Oxomoco (Oks-E’-m6-k6) (AC 4 Level 8; HP 34; #AT 3/2; D: 2-12 open hand) have used the potion once held in the flask to increase their ability to feign death. As with the spell feign death, these two are aware of their environment and what goes on about them. If the monks are disturbed, they will instantly awaken, stand, and Oxomoco will say, first in Olman and then in an ancient dialect of Common, “You have broken/interrupted our long/glorious . . . end/sleep; for this you must pay/repent”. The two will then assume fighting stances. If the monks are not attacked, weapons are not drawn and drawn weapons are sheathed, the two will demand payment of 500 g.p. or one magic item of value as forfeiture. If the two monks are not paid or if the party attempts to harm them while they lie on the couches the monks will attack in return. If questioned about the ruins, they know Nothing to tell, save the message concerning the rain of fire,for their sleep has been long indeed. They will not leave their chambers.
The ivory “wand” is actually a folded fan worth 62 g.p. and the bracelet is platinum and worth 230 g.p. Cipactonal’s amulet is non-magical and made of electrum and garnet, worth 100 S.P.
Now with updated image links (cut-n-paste them into your browser) for the level charts for the different styles. _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
He's kind of a throw-in NPC. He may get used, or not. He is available to join the PC party at the Inn of the Welcome Wench. There are some other mentioned NPCs (plus any others a DM might want to throw in) that might offer to join up too. And Elmo. Not a lot was done for monks beyond the Scarlet Brotherhood namely because not a lot was done with the Baklunish.
Xan Yae and Zuoken are very obviously monk-oriented deities, but the lesson lies with the Suel who do not really have such a deity...and yet there are Scarlet Brotherhood monks of awesomeness. Choose a faith that an aesthetic would fit well into, and have at it.
Another group, the Black Brotherhood, is first mentioned in the 1E adventure I1: Dwellers of the Forbidden City ( see my post #7 on this thread for more info from the original adventure - http://canonfire.com/cf/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2938&highlight=Black%20Brotherhood). If I recall correctly, the Scarlet Brotherhood supplement takes the information on them from there and expands on it, turning them into a full-fledged vigilante group within the Scarlet Brotherhood dedicated to Tharizdun. Now imagine it - a monk of Tharizdun. Oh yes, quite insanely evil no doubt, yet still somehow able to achieve a monk's focus! Oh, the variant monk powers one wants to write up! _________________ - Moderator/Admin (in some areas)/Member -
I'll move the tangential stuff to another thread, later.
RE monks:
Wastri! RIBBET!
He seems like a suitable patron for a monastery of wicked toad-brothers.
Or for the Siv, which are an FR monster that screams Greyhawk to me. Lawful Evil froggers with monk-fu. No doubt the results of Wastrian breeding and training program for improving the chaotic bullywugs.
The SB book by SKR mentions a possible connection between Wastri and the Scarlet Brotherhood. A historical figure named Kevelli Mauk, I think, who might actually be Wastri or else one of his early clerics. EDIT--Not Mauk. See the post by Rasgon below. He's got it right.
Fate of Istus mentions Oriental monks from another world.
I like the idea of the Olman having their own native monk tradition that is not 'Oriental', though. That's cool.
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The SB book by SKR mentions a possible connection between Wastri and the Scarlet Brotherhood. A historical figure named Kevelli Mauk, I think, who might actually be Wastri or else one of his early clerics.
Page 3: "Founded by Kevelli Mauk over a thousand years ago, the Brotherhood of the Scarlet Sign initially did no more than teach the doctrine of racial and cultural purity... The hour before the Rain began, Kevelli was overwhelmed by a premonition of doom; this supernatural warning gave him time to activate a now-lost artifact known as Lendor's Matrix, an hourglass-shaped device that could temporarily suspend time and transport matter across great distances. He gathered his ten most ardent students, their slaves, and the Tome of the Scarlet Sign—the manifesto of the Scarlet Brotherhood—and used the Matrix to teleport to the western side of the Hellfurnaces, moments before the cataclysm eradicated the Suel capital and surrounding lands."
Page 3: "Two of Kevelli's students died when the party entered a stone ruin half-buried in the muck..."
Page 4: "The first appearance of the frog-like demigod Wastri in 5730 SD was met with surprise, confusion, and disgust. "Wastri" had been the name of one of Kevelli's students lost in the swamp so many years before; and the demigod's humanocentrism, and his belief that humanoids existed only to serve humans, paralleled their own philosophy. Regardless of his origins, the Hopping Prophet was obviously tainted."
Note that Monster Mythology (page 101) mentions ruins found "deep within jungles and lost plateaus" left behind by races of proto-amphibians and now-extinct humanoid/frog creatures of which the bullywugs are degenerate descendants where avatars of the sleeping frog god Ramenos can still be summoned. My guess is that Wastri stumbled into one of those and somehow summoned an avatar or aspect of Ramenos into himself, appearing dead at first but gaining a spark of the sleeping god's divinity, which eventually corrupted and transformed him until he became a demigod in his own right.
The SB book by SKR mentions a possible connection between Wastri and the Scarlet Brotherhood. A historical figure named Kevelli Mauk, I think, who might actually be Wastri or else one of his early clerics.
Page 3: "Founded by Kevelli Mauk over a thousand years ago, the Brotherhood of the Scarlet Sign initially did no more than teach the doctrine of racial and cultural purity... The hour before the Rain began, Kevelli was overwhelmed by a premonition of doom; this supernatural warning gave him time to activate a now-lost artifact known as Lendor's Matrix, an hourglass-shaped device that could temporarily suspend time and transport matter across great distances. He gathered his ten most ardent students, their slaves, and the Tome of the Scarlet Sign—the manifesto of the Scarlet Brotherhood—and used the Matrix to teleport to the western side of the Hellfurnaces, moments before the cataclysm eradicated the Suel capital and surrounding lands."
Page 3: "Two of Kevelli's students died when the party entered a stone ruin half-buried in the muck..."
Page 4: "The first appearance of the frog-like demigod Wastri in 5730 SD was met with surprise, confusion, and disgust. "Wastri" had been the name of one of Kevelli's students lost in the swamp so many years before; and the demigod's humanocentrism, and his belief that humanoids existed only to serve humans, paralleled their own philosophy. Regardless of his origins, the Hopping Prophet was obviously tainted."
Note that Monster Mythology (page 101) mentions ruins found "deep within jungles and lost plateaus" left behind by races of proto-amphibians and now-extinct humanoid/frog creatures of which the bullywugs are degenerate descendants where avatars of the sleeping frog god Ramenos can still be summoned. My guess is that Wastri stumbled into one of those and somehow summoned an avatar or aspect of Ramenos into himself, appearing dead at first but gaining a spark of the sleeping god's divinity, which eventually corrupted and transformed him until he became a demigod in his own right.
Ah, yes. I should have gone downstairs and checked before posting. I don't own Fate of Istus any longer but I've never parted with my copy of The Scarlet Brotherhood.
I do recall that FoI gives a rather different history of the Scarlet Brotherhood, with monks from Kara Tur being involved.
I agree about a possible link with Ramenos.
(I was just skimming through Monster Mythology last night).
Mention of Wastri and frog monks reminded me of the Kuo Toan Monitors from D2, Descent into the Depths of the Oerth. Since the monk-classed Monitor is a staple of Kuo Toan society, Blibdoolpoolp must be the source of their abilities. Alternatively, one could invent a more extensive Kuo Toan pantheon...
On a related note, has the alignment discrepancy between monks (lawful) and Xan Yae and Zuoken (both true neutral) ever been explained?
Sure, Xan Yae, being a goddess, can be explained away as not being subject to the same rules mortals are.
Zuoken, however, is canonically an ascended mortal.
This has me seriously considering opening the monk class to other alignments. At least, making it available to non-chaotics.
Monks don't get their monk-fu from a god, so I don't know that LN monks worshiping a TN goddess is really a discrepancy. The alignments are only one step apart, so it's not like there's a major conflict.
Her clerics/specialty priests are a different question.
I did allow a TN monk who worshiped Zuoken in the last GH game I ran, a couple of years back.
On a related note, has the alignment discrepancy between monks (lawful) and Xan Yae and Zuoken (both true neutral) ever been explained?
Sure, Xan Yae, being a goddess, can be explained away as not being subject to the same rules mortals are.
Zuoken, however, is canonically an ascended mortal.
This has me seriously considering opening the monk class to other alignments. At least, making it available to non-chaotics.
Monks don't get their monk-fu from a god, so I don't know that LN monks worshiping a TN goddess is really a discrepancy. The alignments are only one step apart, so it's not like there's a major conflict. . . .
I'm not saying monk abilities are divine gifts whatsoever.
My point is that it's odd for monk-oriented deities to not be lawful, especially since Zuoken, as a mortal, had to be lawful to gain his monk abilities in the first place.
Furthermore, both deities espouse a philosophy of balance, which seems an odd fit for the strictly-lawful monk class.
I'd wager EGG wasn't too concerned about this discrepancy when the '83 box came out, or may have simply overlooked it, since monks in OD&D could be of any alignment (per the Blackmoor supplement).
1 Zuoken was LN as a mortal until Xan Yae's wisdom converted him to TN.
2 Xan Yae's clerics/priests (who possess some monkish abilities) are TN.
Monks who revere the twilight goddess are LN. The don't believe in 'balance' but rather in perfection and see the Supreme Mistress of Petals as a perfected being.
3 monks can be of any alignment, or of any non-chaotic alignment, but most are lawful.
4 Baklunish monks can be TN. And these monks possess a somewhat different tradition, which shows in a divergent set of class abilities.
I'd wager EGG wasn't too concerned about this discrepancy when the '83 box came out, or may have simply overlooked it, since monks in OD&D could be of any alignment (per the Blackmoor supplement).
When designing the 1983 boxed set, they actually deliberately grandfathered in some setting elements inherited from older editions of the game. In Dragon #141, Skip Williams mentioned this to explain the single-class elven clerics with edged weapons.
Sage Advice, Dragon #141 wrote:
The random-encounter tables include single-classed elven clerics equipped with edged weapons. Isn't this impossible in an AD&D game world?
Mr. Gygax's Greyhawk campaign was started long before the AD&D game came on the scene. The first rules used were the three booklets and (later) three supplements of the original D&D game. In time, Mr. Gygax used what he learned from running Greyhawk to write the AD&D game rules. The campaign, which was older than the AD&D game rules, could not be switched over to them because the D&D game and AD&D game rules are not compatible. When TSR published the WORLD OF GREYHAWK fantasy setting, the editors decided to remain faithful to the original campaign. This is how this rule-breaker got in.
The WoG boxed set includes modified clerics with special weapons and powers.
Glossography p 38.
In AD&D1E I'd do the same thing for elf clerics with edged weapons.
I normally run AD&D2E, B/X, or (online only) D20. I'd handle sword-wielding clerics a bit differently under each rule-set, of course.
Didn't DMPrata create a document with WoG style modified clerics for a whole bunch of GH gods under 1st ed rules?
I think their editorial direction was all over the place on that count. The short story "Prying Eyes", the adventure "Provincial Prior Cause", and the novel The Bloody Eye mention Ratik and the Kingdom of Schnai, but the other novels are set in a new land called the Duchy of Koratia.
The characters from the novels appear in other sources with closer ties to Oerth, though, like The Scourge of Worlds.
It's been great reading the multiple threads about monks in and around the Flanaess.
Have any of you developed organizations for demi-human monks? Although 1e precluded this in the PHB, as another poster mentioned, Fiend Folio introduced kuo-toa monitors and githzerai monks, and later editions abolished the only-human requirement.
I ask because I'm developing a 5e campaign (mentioned in various posts these past few months), which will center on the Hold of the Sea Princes, and one of my players has chosen to create a wood elf monk.
As we've presently created, he is from the Dreadwood but was chosen to travel to Celene to train at a monastery therein. We have yet to detail it but are imagining a corollary order to the 2e blade singer kit (and derivatives) and the war dancers of Warhammer Fantasy Role Play.
So, what of it, have any of you created non-human monk orders IYC, or as the editions have changed, have you allowed demi-human monks into your human monk traditions?
Have any of you developed organizations for demi-human monks?
No, but...
Dragon Magazine #122 has an article entitled "Marshalling the Martial Arts" which may be of help to you.
Also, I remember a variant warrior class from a Dungeon Magazine adventure on the Dark Continent. I believe it was the Battle Dancer. It was re-written in the Dragon Compendium, but I can't find the original article. I always thought that class was a variant of the monk class as much as it was a variant on the fighter class. It may provide some inspiration for variant monkish orders in your campaign.
Also, I remember a variant warrior class from a Dungeon Magazine adventure on the Dark Continent. I believe it was the Battle Dancer. It was re-written in the Dragon Compendium, but I can't find the original article. I always thought that class was a variant of the monk class as much as it was a variant on the fighter class. It may provide some inspiration for variant monkish orders in your campaign.
SirXaris
You're thinking of "Rhythm Warriors" in Dragon #159.
Blackmoor deserves mention here!
1) monks were originally introduced in Supplement II.
2) Weining officially established Wastri's cult in Greyhawk's Blackmoor, specifically the Cold Mashes, encouraging the addition of the Temple of the Frog and its monks to Greyhawk.
3) Blackmoor also has the very monkish Docrae halflings worthy of consideration. Adding Docrae to Greyhawk is a good way to break multiple expectations, as Greyhawk's halflings are extremely vanilla and the "exotic" monk class is surprisingly staid and stereotypical.
--
UK4 When a Star Falls also has an order of monks in a remote, very western medieval setting serving a priesthood concerned with celestial bodies. With four of the UK series being officially placed in Greyhawk and no other setting claiming the outliers, UK4 is arguably Greyhawk-lite. I placed it Tenh at the mountainous headwaters of the Zumkend, reasoning the astrological priests were Pholtus worshippers whose obsession with their god's sun and moon concerns led to their banishment from the Theocracy of the Pale. Their monk bodyguards could be a unique development, an alliance with a splinter of Suel monks that followed the Thrillonian migration instead of the Tilvanot, or some other source.
Right The Temple of the Frog exists in every iteration of Greyhawk, and per Supp II and later Blackmoor lore is chock full of Monks.
For some reason people seem to forget that Toads are not Frogs any more than say, zebras are horses or monkeys are apes.
The Temple of the Frog monks have nothing to do with the toad loving Wastri, in fact they very likely hate them because they have an entirely opposite philosophy. Per D&D supplement II, the froggies hate their humanity and believe it to be inferior to amphibian life.
The monks worship the frog god Tsathoggus, engage in the slave trade and attempt to transform people including themselves into frog folk through magic and surgery.
The monks will therefore be in various states of their original human and humanoid selves melded with amphibian features.
Monks of the temple of the Frog are divided into several ranks:
1. Heart of the Frog (High Priest): The leader of the cult wears long loose crimson robes, and posses a staff (of withering) as a badge of office.
2. Fins of the Frog: The inner circle of the priesthood, consisting of class levels 3 and above. There are 10 Keepers, 13 Officers, and a council of 12 Priests. They wear gilt-edged Dark Green hooded cloaks fastened with gold brooches in the shape of a frog holding a small struggling human in its mouth.
3. Teeth of the Frog (Acolytes): The 96 acolytes wear black-edged light green cloaks. The teeth consist of clerics and Magic-users of 1st and 2nd level.
4. Chorus of the frog: The chorus consist of the followers, servants and 0-2 level soldiers obedient to the temple
5. and a magic-user sub order known as "The Keepers" who are in charge of the breeding programs.
This information drawn from all three versions of the Temple of the Frog adventure in addition to the Garbage Pits of Despair adventure. Tsathoggus is first detailed in Supplement IV Gods, Demi-gods and Heroes. _________________ The eternal war between Law and Chaos flared often in Greyhawk... But the laws of Chance will let neither gain full sway. Quag Keep, Chap 1&2
This thread is really interesting but a bit scattered so I thought I would make a cut and paste list of all the orders in official sources mentioned so far (will happily add anything missed):
The Sapphire Brotherhood in the Fate of Istus
The Scarlet Brotherhood.
Order of Nerull Dragon #299 details an order of monks dedicated to Nerull, drawn from the novel Oath of Nerull by T.H. Lain.
Order of the Fire Opal - "Dungeon of the Fire Opal" in Dungeon #84 The monks there once worshiped Wee Jas.
The Twilight Monks - in the Cairn Hills is dedicated to Xan Yae. It's detailed in Age of Worms Overload.
Monks of Zuoken - Three monasteries dedicated to Zuoken. The Falla-nil monastery is in the Ulsprues. The Azor-khem monastery is 60 miles to the south. The Flannae-tel Monastery is in the Cairn Hills) found in Erik Mona's "Baklunish Delights" in Oerth Journal #3
Cannibal Monks - The Savage Tide AP, from Dungeon Magazine, featured a cannabalistic order of monks who had a monastery in Scuttlecove.
The Nacehuel (Na-sG’-wal: “the achieved ones”) - Olman monks in Tamoachan.
The Black Brotherhood, is first mentioned in the 1E adventure I1: Dwellers of the Forbidden City a full-fledged vigilante group within the Scarlet Brotherhood dedicated to Tharizdun. Now imagine it - a monk of Tharizdun. Oh yes, quite insanely evil no doubt,
The Kuo Toan Monitors - from D2, Descent into the Depths of the Oerth. Since the monk-classed Monitor is a staple of Kuo Toan society, Blibdoolpoolp must be the source of their abilities.
The Order of the Frog - The Temple of the Frog, Blackmoor/northern Cold Marsh.
New one:
Monks of St. Cuthbert -There is a monastery-fortress of St. Cuthbert in the canton of Clatspurgen, Perrenland. [LGG, 86]
what else? _________________ The eternal war between Law and Chaos flared often in Greyhawk... But the laws of Chance will let neither gain full sway. Quag Keep, Chap 1&2
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