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Adept Greytalker
Joined: Sep 20, 2004
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From: British Isles
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Tue Feb 15, 2022 10:35 am
Basmajian Arras
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From the Ashes has Basmajian Arras as a TN W11/T5 but in Ivid the Undying he's listed as a LE fighter of 13th-level. The LGG seems to follow its lead from Ivid and has the Lord High Admiral also as a 13th-level fighter (although interestingly he seems not to have learnt anything at all in 6 years remaining the same level in 591CY as he is in 585CY).
I'm wondering if anyone knows why Carl Sargent disregarded the info in From the Ashes and went with his own version of Basmajian? Was the FtA info a mistype like with Belissaca/Lorinar?
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GreySage
Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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From: Michigan
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Thu Feb 17, 2022 7:30 pm
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Well, Carl Sargent wrote both sources, so they're both his version of Basmajian Arras.
If it's not an error (and it might well be), it's likely Carl Sargent thought better of his original version and was correcting it to something he thought was more appropriate.
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Adept Greytalker
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Fri Feb 18, 2022 1:31 am
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Thanks rasgon!
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Apprentice Greytalker
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Fri Feb 18, 2022 2:52 pm
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Another point to consider is that Ivid the Undying was not a commercial product and Carl did not get around to looking back at the other source or the editing was less than thorough. These circumstances suggest there is a fair chance that version of Basmajian Arras is just an error.
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Master Greytalker
Joined: May 12, 2005
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From: Woonsocket, RI, USA
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Sat Feb 19, 2022 11:25 am
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Where in From the Ashes is Basmajian Arras listed as a W11/T5? That’s an unlikely (though not impossible) class combination in AD&D 2E.
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GreySage
Joined: Aug 03, 2001
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From: Michigan
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Sat Feb 19, 2022 11:53 am
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| DMPrata wrote: |
| Where in From the Ashes is Basmajian Arras listed as a W11/T5? That’s an unlikely (though not impossible) class combination in AD&D 2E. |
It's on the "Nations of the Flanaess" reference card (Reference Card #2).
Looking into it, I see that the pre-Wars ruler of the Sea Barons, Sencho Foy, was a 13th level fighter in the Glossography. From the Ashes had Basmajian Arras as a Wizard 11/Thief 5, but Ivid the Undying (and its excerpt in Dragon #206) gave him Sencho Foy's class and level.
Given that, I think it's probably a mistake. It's Sencho Foy who was the fighter; Basmajian is a wizard/thief. Or, at least, he was intended to be. The equipment given to him in Ivid (chain mail, gauntlets of ogre power) obviously fits with him better as a fighter, as Sencho was. So either I'd either write the wizard/thief levels off as an attempt at differentiating him from his predecessor that was forgotten about and doesn't jibe with more detailed writings, or else use the description of him in Ivid as a description of Sencho Foy and give Basmajian more appropriate equipment.
As for why he doesn't increase in level between 585 and 591, Ivid tells us "Arras lives richly and well... He is content with his lot, and he seeks to preserve his own strength." It doesn't sound like he's pushing himself to earn experience points.
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Master Greytalker
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Sat Feb 19, 2022 12:42 pm
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Thanks, rasgon. Yeah, I guess Sargent forgot what he’d done in From the Ashes when he was working on Ivid and reverted to the F13 from the Gazetteer. Still, W11/T5 is a quite unusual combination for AD&D 2E. That notation suggests he’s a dual-classed character who quit being a wizard at 11th level and became a thief, but he’s still only a 5th-level thief and can’t mix class functions—not the kind of character you’d expect to be an admiral.
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GreySage
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From: Michigan
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Sun Feb 20, 2022 9:36 pm
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| DMPrata wrote: |
| Thanks, rasgon. Yeah, I guess Sargent forgot what he’d done in From the Ashes when he was working on Ivid and reverted to the F13 from the Gazetteer. Still, W11/T5 is a quite unusual combination for AD&D 2E. That notation suggests he’s a dual-classed character who quit being a wizard at 11th level and became a thief, but he’s still only a 5th-level thief and can’t mix class functions—not the kind of character you’d expect to be an admiral. |
Good point. It does seem unlikely that a Name-level wizard would give up his spells to become a low-level thief. It would be more likely if Basmajian was a 5th-level burglar who decided to learn magic and got quite good at it. But in either case, that would be a very different character from what we see in Ivid the Undying.
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Adept Greytalker
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Mon Feb 21, 2022 1:27 am
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If we went with the dual-class version, going by 2e rules he can still use his wizard abilities he just doesn't gain any xp as a thief for the encounter that he does this in and subsequently 50% xp for the rest of the 'adventure'.
It's possible that since becoming ruler Basmajian has found himself often needing to fall back on his wizardly knowledge which is why his level as thief remains low?
I quite like the FtA version of Basmajian, there's only a handful of other magic-users ruling regions so it makes him stand out a bit more.
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