Last weekend, I finally sat down to draw maps that show how I think the dungeon level elements of S4 The Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth fit together as a whole---the entrances, exits, additional hinted-at levels, sinkholes, underground streams, and what-not of the Lesser Caverns and the Greater Caverns. (I've also been working on this page in general over the past two months or so, including adding comprisons between the 1976 Tsojconth tournament version and the 1982 module, among other things).
Please check the maps out (the file's about 2.5 MB), and give me some feedback on them. In particular, I'm looking for some guidance from those of you who are better cartographers than me on how to orient the maps so that I can correctly identify directions that will be consistent with how I display the levels themselves and their relationships to one another. While I still want the the maps to communicate as much spatial information as possible to their readers, and I'm sure that the way that I've drawn the maps now is correct from a distance-from-one-element-to-another POV (the space between the Lesser and Greater Caverns, etc.), I am also quite sure that the directions are munged. For example, I think the Greater Caverns should be pivoted relative the Lesser Caverns (since you enter the GC from the W, not from the N), and the umber hulk tunnels exit on the north face of the mountain, whereas the Great Cavern corridor exits on the west. I'm not sure if it's really possible to show those kinds of relationships without a 3-D map??? It's those kindses of tricksy, nasty errorses that I needses your helps with, my precious....
If it would help with helping me, I can scan and post my working notes, which show how I distilled the distances, depths, etc. from the module descriptions. (For those paying very close attention at home, I intentionally extended the Lesser Caverns D River Exit waterfall to 450' from 100', since the original distance in the tourney was 450' and that seems more consistent to me with the "distant roaring" that PCs would hear as they approach the edge of the map---I think if that waterfall was only 100' away, it would be LOT louder!).
I'm also looking for some general input on the format, layout, etc. on the maps: are they clear, do they provide useful info, etc.? I'll eventually get around to buidling the underwater lake dungeon level---it may well be where I place Iggwilv's living quarters, etc. (assuming that I don't just connect them via gates to the Lost Caverns and have them very much elsewhere, perhaps the Sea of Dust area...).
Did Lost Caverns ever appear on the TSR/ Wizards site as a free download? I remember Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun did, for a while but I don't know if this one is/ was. _________________ Accuracy is our watchwurd
Did Lost Caverns ever appear on the TSR/ Wizards site as a free download? I remember Forgotten Temple of Tharizdun did, for a while but I don't know if this one is/ was.
Apparently several of the sites hosted by greyhawkonline.com are having a problem with trojan spyware being distributed from them, including my site, moretellan's GH web comic, Realms of Evil, etc.
For folks using Firefox and with up-to-date Windows patches, they seem to be OK so far. Others have not been so lucky.
Looks like things are fixed, please feel free to check out the files and provide feedback on the maps :D _________________ Allan Grohe (grodog@gmail.com)
http://www.greyhawkonline.com/grodog/greyhawk.html
The maps you did look good. The only thing I can say - I despise waste. Why have empty multi-mile long tunnels? If you have tunnels that long, why not have them branch off into little sub-ares? If not, shorten them. Also, don't forget that caves are rarely flat areas; throw in some slopes and drops. "The Cave" is a poor movie, but shows cave terrain very nicely, and Monte Cook did a great article on caves at his website (and I think repeated in an issue of Dragon, or Dungeon).
The maps you did look good. The only thing I can say - I despise waste. Why have empty multi-mile long tunnels? If you have tunnels that long, why not have them branch off into little sub-ares? If not, shorten them.
Sorry, my original note probably wasn't fully clear on that: I've tried to replicate the additional tunnels, side levels, caves, etc. that Gygax detailed in S4, without otherwise changing them. For example, he mentions specifically that the umber hulk tunnel intersects four caves throughout it's trip to the surface, but the dracolisk tunnel does not. Hence, I didn't add or change them (at this time :D ).
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Also, don't forget that caves are rarely flat areas; throw in some slopes and drops. "The Cave" is a poor movie, but shows cave terrain very nicely, and Monte Cook did a great article on caves at his website (and I think repeated in an issue of Dragon, or Dungeon).
My scans may not have caught the level shadings that I did in the Umber Hulk caves (in particular); I basically used the same conventions that are in D1-2, with solid and dashed lines for rises and falls in elevation. I'll see if I can tighten the scans up and/or darken the lines so that they're more visible.
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