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Tolerance of what?

Who are the Velunese authorities intolerant towards? Evil cultists?
Witches who practice black magic?

People in an evil society could be very tolerant. They might raise no ...

VARIANT
.

Pelor is the source of all light and life and power. He came into being before any other beings of power, born when the sun's light first burned in the primal darkness of Oerth's Crysta ...

Rasgon, that"Craster's Keep'" take on it could mesh with my crazy lumberjack suggestion.
Who does not love creepy inbred cultists in the back country?

I read "no drawing" as meaning specifically ...

RE Sutemi's idea of " imperfect worship"

I don't think Heiroenous has to dictate all the exact customs and traditions he wants his worshippers everywhere on the Oerth to follow, down to facial h ...

Lumberoneous!

Eileen, PM sent.

My main question is what is going on culturally/politically that makes this reactionary version of Heironeous's faith appealing? Regardless of the initial inspiration, whether a psychotic break or gen ...

RE polygamy and other customs

I don't see what this has to do with alignment.

And I don't see anything else on the list that makes women "second class." Even if I did, I don't see how that woul ...

It is so different from my take on religion in GH that I would not use it.
But that does not mean it is bad.

Some questions:

Prohibition on drawing images of the three gods perplexes me.
Why ...

But for my part I think I would prefer to place Rhesdain nearby. The Darlene map is quite large and thus leaves plenty of room for small principalities.

I think even if you make it one of Perrenla ...

RE Demihumans and magical decline

I don't see any particular connection.

Several demihuman races are actually less magical than humans. Namely; dwarves, Halflings, and gnomes ( gnomes in regard ...

RE Child's Play

I have seen a copy and read reviews, but I do not own one.
So please pardon any mistakes in what follows.

My impression of the module is that the PCs are tasked with stopping a ...

RE: Oriental monks and the SB

I don't see anything I would describe as problematic.
It all ties up quite nicely, with no big holes in logic or missing links.

Rather, I would describe it as un ...

It is interesting that some guys group things like some monsters from Barsoom and the crashed spaceship section in Exp. to the Barrier Peaks in with pun names.

I get that some guys want a more " To ...

It is interesting that some guys group things like some monsters from Barsoom and the crashed spaceship section in Exp. to the Barrier Peaks in with pun names.

I get that some guys want a more " To ...

, I believe in Monster Mythology. I have recently nabbed a copy. Good book. Generic, but because of that easy to use with GH.

There are some subtle Greyhawk references (or, more specifically, From ...

Fenmarel, a bit of an outcast himself among the Seldarine, and one who assists elves in wild areas, is perhaps a better choice as a patron Power.

-Lanthorn

Yeah, I've tried to make that case, si ...

Fenmarel, a bit of an outcast himself among the Seldarine, and one who assists elves in wild areas, is perhaps a better choice as a patron Power.

-Lanthorn
He may be a better match, if:

1 You ...

I should dig my copy out of the bedroom gaming crate.

But, yeah, Doctor Doom sounds fun!

RE Ehlonna and the Valley Elves

Maybe she is their primary deity from a long way back, but in recent ...

I do prefer polytheism as the rule.
Thus the gnomes would worship Ehlonna, but not as their only deity.
Ditto the Tree People's worship of Lirr.

I also prefer the Mage to be neutral instead of ev ...

Cloud forest might work.

Seems temperate here:
www.canonfire.com/wiki/index.php?title=Valley_of_the_Mage

I like that.

I also dig the arboreal humans. Lirr makes sense to me.

Heffalumps c ...

It has never once come into play, but I rather do like the idea that the art of magic will someday fade on the Oerth, or at least in the Flanaess.

Sorry, CSL.
But I am not knocking your preferenc ...

1 Sense of humor. The world can be grim, but there's no lack of weird and whimsical stuff.

2 sci fi garnish with the fantasy stew. Barsoom, Expedition to the Barrier Peaks. Etc.

3 regional ident ...

Going for the chrome dome Anton LeVay look is a clue to Mordenkainen's creeping alignment shift.

Wow.

Rejecting GH modules out of hand? Lame!

So when does Vecna/Halmadar kill most of the Circle?

582 CY?

Edit: Greywiki says 581, months after Jallarzi joins.

Indeed, great help with the development/ publication history!

Thanks, Vestcoat.

I think the issue with a neutral serving his own interests above all else is that he then becomes neutral evil.

But maybe that is what just what happened with Rary?

And Mordenkainen may be delu ...

Okay, I've finally seen the Battle of Five Armies, and my final opinion is, to paraphrase Patton Oswalt, if I actually had a time machine, I would go back to around 2006 or 2007 and kill Peter Jackson ...

I may be in the minority here.

B minus For LoTR movies and Hobbit movies, I would say. The films are badly paced. Slow. Too much extended hiking across NZ time. And when the action heats up, Jacks ...

Indeed!

Merry Christmas, guys.

Stay safe on the roads, if you are traveling.

Best wishes,

-CM

5e takes it a step further, Neutral is for beings that have the frontal lobes to consider law vs. chaos and good vs. evil, while beasts are unaligned. I guess this depends on what edition of the align ...

Your reference to the rilmani makes me think of Planescape. And that reminds me to ask:
You are Rip Van Wormer, right?

Yes.

Coolios.

I don't get on Planewalker or similar boards very often, ...

What I am trying to articulate is that militant True Neutral makes little sense. I mainly mean the insistence on maintaining neutrality between good and evil as an ideological position.

This kind o ...

IMO, True Neutral works for Druids, if they remain focused on nature rather than human society and morals. It also makes sense for certain apathetic or fatalist cults, like Istus and Boccob.

If y ...

First, something to set the tone:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=k8ws_APXilE

For purposes of this thread, I am defining True Neutral as the Gygaxian "Balance" alignment, the one described ...

It does seem that Allton is a member of the upper tier of the Circle of Eight, like Bigby is, rather than one of the Circle's lesser members like the henchmen from Vecna Lives!.

Allton was, after ...

Telenovelas of the Suel Imperium

With 100% more passionate kissing and angry face- smacking.

Does Xerbo take exception to Kord mating with Osprem?

There could be a story in that.

Robilar may split with Rary if you go by material in the latest published module featuring him.

Removing the Circle of Eight as a faction might actually strengthen the forces of good. (If Iuz is also removed, as the OP suggests). The Circle is arguably as much a hindrance to the forces of weal a ...

So it looks as if the first TSR published reference to the Circle of Eight comes in 1985, in Isle of the Ape.
Which means I was correct that the Circle of Eight is not in the Folio or the WoG boxed s ...

But I am interested in what the Citadel looked like, and how it differed in composition and purpose from the Circle of Eight ( as presented in City of Greyhawk.)

I don't remember where I read this ...

Which sources do you consider core, essential, or most useful to your conception of GH?
What stuff do you not use at all, or borrow from in part?

For me the core is the WoG boxed set, with seconda ...

CombatMedic, we seem to be on the same page and I get that GH is GH with or without the famous personages, but I want to correct a few misconceptions.
(Mordenkainen) does not even show up in the Fol ...

CombatMedic, we seem to be on the same page and I get that GH is GH with or without the famous personages, but I want to correct a few misconceptions.
(Mordenkainen) does not even show up in the Fol ...

The Shackled City

Many slaves toil in Cauldron's mines, workshops, and quarries that the city. By law, all wear chains. This has earned the nickname " The Shackled City."
Slaves also provide mos ...

Hahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Katanas.

THARIZDUN

He stands alone at the end of time, filled with the power of eternal darkness.
(Monster Mythology, yo)

And HEAVY METAL!!!

Okay, had to get that out of my system.

Dragon #293 had a really interesting article on small gods, dividing them up into ancestral gods, heroes, saints, and gods of the land. They include Tumblemoon, a divinity worshiped by rabbits and a s ...

IMHO the issue with FR was never the number of high level NPCs (as per the 1987 boxed set and 1E products there were probably as many as GH) but rather how they were used and abused by TSR / WotC.

...

Just to be clear, I really like the City of Greyhawk boxed set. I think Niles, Sargent, and Rose did a great job. It is my favorite city sourcebook(boxed set, in this case) for any game. I like the ma ...

Circle of Eight?

It was not introduced until 1989, IIRC. It's easy enough to just say no such group exists.
After all, it did not exist until it was made up by TSR designers after Gygax left, usin ...

Looks cool. It appeals to my love of all things necromantic and Wee Jas.

CombatMedic

As my post indicated the Circle of Eight was used only as an example of a group of high level individuals who might get involved in a crises (for any number of reasons as you indicated ...

When I ran GH with B/X (thus using the 1--14 for humans and lower for demihumans scale) I adjusted NPC levels accordingly.

Circle of Eight?

It was not introduced until 1989, IIRC. It's easy enough to just say no such group exists.
After all, it did not exist until it was made up by TSR designers after Gygax left, usin ...

LOL, World of typo.

World of Greyhawk

Pretty cool, Rasgon.

Who are the Tolax? Are they from SKR's Scatlet Brotherhood book? Some guys you made up?

I like that you include a Petty Gods reference with the Islanders.

I use the WoD boxed set as my principal source for the setting. It does not appear overpopulated with high level types. They are mostly rulers.
The vast majority did not even have names listed in the ...

I knew Rasgon would get in on this. ;)

I am a big fan of the small gods stuff in GH. It seems like a natural fit with demigods, local deities, heroes, and so on.

Those are all fun takes on it.

My slaves vary in ethnic origins, although many are Suloise from the Amedio. But they can also come from among the native poor, debtors, and felons.
You can't tell w ...

This thread is for integrating into GH the deities of Unknown Gods (Judges Guild) and the gods of Petty Gods.

If a contributor hasn't got a copy of Unknown Gods, he won't be able to do much about ...

It looks like Ehlonna is also worshipped. Maybe just in Berghof, or maybe in other areas as well.
Her rivalry with Obad Hai could spice things up if I use both powers in the Hold.

Either her cult ...

Tortuga, nice!

I am looking at gods next.

Given the geography, demography, and dominant alignment( Neutral) I think:

Bralm?
Joramy (Common deity, neutral aligned, Hell-furnaces fit portfo ...

http://unfrozencavemandicechucker.blogspot.com/2013/02/ethnology-of-greyhawk-who-lives-in-hold.html

First, thanks to the blogger for writing a fun blog.

Next, using these ideas as I develop my v ...

Jakandor is, of course, an Advanced Dungeons and Dragons source, so there is some work required to bring it up to date (in our case, it started out as AD&D, then moved to d20 and now is PF).

Bu ...

CM,

At that point in the campaign, there was a lot of maritime play. Midlevel stuff was mostly pirates, after about 12th level or so, moved more onto exploration; especially using Rick Miller's Oer ...

Note:

I admire and appreciate the work that SKR and Mona have done on GH.
Bigtime.
So I hope nobody reads my comments about customization and taking things in a different direction as negative cr ...

Besides Sasserine and Cauldron, there is Fort Blackwell on the tip of the Amedian peninsula. It is featured in The Savage Tide AP and in my adventure in the Canonfire! Chronicles, #1. Wink

Sir ...

RE Amedio coast cities, I like what you suggest.

If I do not add actual large cities on the jungle coast, I will use Sasserine and Cauldron, but modified. Maybe the Olman were the true founders ...

Why bother with all that, risking your life in the green hell, when you can just drop anchor on the coast and buy captives from any of several native tribes? Much smarter.

If communities on the Am ...

Interesting notes, especially the last two.

I'm assuming something closer to 576 than the LG era. Do you see any connections between the slave-taking by the Yellow Sails and the Slavelords (IMC th ...

I will share some of my very sketchy notes for a possible future campaign based/ starting in that area.

Slave stuff in The Hold

Slaves' conditions and origins

Slaves here enjoy some protect ...

Pretty hardcore,Rasgon!

I like the Erythnul reference. He's one of my favorite evil gods.

Fun stuff, guys!

RE GreyMage and the SB book by SKR, Mist Kingdom

Yes, I have the book complete with the map.

Has your campaign involved a lot of piracy, sea and island exploration, maritime ...

Do Amazons dwell in Hardby, as the Minifigs line suggests?

Hepmonaland?
Amedio?

West of the Paynims?

They have a listing as monsters in AD&D 2E, with the Greyhawk logo on the page.

An ...

Riots. Boom, answer. Trithereon cultists are a bunch of malcontents and rabble rousers. I would not be surprised if cult activity faced official disapproval in a number of realms. LG regimes, too, n ...

From what I understand, female ligers are fertile, while male ligers are sterile. Crossbreeds of polar and grizzly bears are always fertile. Mules and hinnies are rarely fertile. It depends on how clo ...

Grateful for the interest, but rather surprised most responses involve canonical and fractional comments.

Frankly; I would have thought the motivational aspects are more tantalizing. For instances; ...

All of that makes sense to me.

In my next game, I will likely add dozens of petty states, protectorates, vassal states, and so on to the Flanaess. There's certainly plenty of room for them on the ...

Scarlet Brotherhood : Nazi +Soviet +Assassins (the sect)

Yeomanry: Maybe like the Westermark from the Conan stories by REH? So sort of Drums along the Mohawk with Medieval trappings.
Could also b ...

I've seen the OP's art on Dragonsfoot.

It's really nice stuff. I like the action and humor I see in these pieces.

Seems legit.

Though " feudalism" is problematic in historiography, it is well suited for use a a game term.
IMO and YMMV

Tangent alert:
Tarleton, have you increased populations?
Or are the se ...

Slavery is rampant in the Great kingdom, according to Ivid the undying.

I should re read that one

Slavery in Nyrond seems to come up sometimes. Is this from one of the AD&D 2E books?

Interesting stuff, guys!

I am still developing my notes. I start with the Free City of Greyhawk.

Free City of Greyhawk:Slavery is legal, but no one is born a slave in the city or its outlying ...

Which realms or regions have forms of slavery? What about serfdom? Indentured servitude? Debt peonage?
Other forms of bondage and/or unfree status?

As usual, I don't care much about a strictly ca ...

Never really considered this in any detail but have had cross-breeds have offspring in my campaigns (generally half elves).

I have always followed a rule, though, that only two elf parents can prod ...

I prefer crossbreeds to be sterile as a general rule.
But of course a Wish could be employed to get around the problem.

The Greywiki states that they are siblings.

I don't see what is so awkward about it. Egyptian mythology has this, too.

YMMV

And although it's not credited, Landron: God of Order, Winds and the Seasons, Landron has fallen out of favor with the people of the Flanaess and now enjoys worship in only large centers of religion, ...

Coolios. Thanks, Rasgon.

Can somebody give me a summary of the lore (whatever one thinks of its canonical status) from the Rose Estes GH novels?

What about Quag Keep (Andre Norton)?

Other GH authors?

I do not care ...

Alignment

I am strongly considering adopting the AD&D 1E rule that prohibits clerics from being True Neutral.

That may be a Druid only thing.

I will have to look it up.I don't recall if ...

I see Celestian as a god of death, too. As god of far journeys and the Astral Plane, he acts as a psychopomp, watching over souls as they cross over to the Outer Planes.

Sehanine has a similar rol ...

And doesn't it mention in The Adventure Begins that St Cuthbert high priestess Eritai Kaan-Ipzirel of Greyhawk City has been divorced something like 5 times?

-Lanthorn
I don't have that one.

...

I like Rasgon's Classical approach to this. Celibate and chaste huntresses of Ehlonna look good to me.
Local cults can differ from common patterns.

I think celibate Hextorians and Heironean pries ...

There is a married priestess of Saint Cuthbert in the Gnarleywood, according to the CoGH boxed set.

I boost Wee Jas's profile in part because I like having a prominent non-evil deity of death.
I go with her alignment as listed in the boxed set. She is lawful neutral. No evil tendencies.